64

sfa 3 rose thread

i've been playing rose for a while and think she is highly underestimated and she can hang with mostly all the top tiers anyone thats plays rose post something up ill post some stuff if im wrong just let me know

dhalsim: this is a good match for rose because she can low strong all of his pokes i think not 2 sure she can either down fierce his drills or lv1 air throw it and reflect his fireballs it doesnt seem like dhalsim can do much in this match

against v gouki this match is kind of hard because of akuma's dive kick but other than that it's fairly easy when he dive kick's just lv 1 air throw and you will floor him which creates a chance to gc a good amount of his bar stay within her standing rh range and just abuse it pretty much just try to keep him on the ground and you should be able to win if he tries to chip you with his custom just alpha counter it and you should escape and be able to hit him im not 2 sure how her alpha counter works

i dont really play any other roses just a so help from a v rose player would be good
«1

Comments

  • SaBrESaBrE BAI BAI Joined: Posts: 4,495Registered, Moderators
    heres some advice, learn to use periods "." so i can breathe when reading. <----
    AZ fighting game crew, team hAZmat

    www.teamhazmataz.com

    www.twitch.tv/teamhazmat
  • Unknown Joined:
    perhaps 1 day
  • Unknown Joined:
    I use rose a lot in A3, and I'm sorry to say she is kind of one dimensional. I think she has a really bad match against V-Sak because c.strong doesn't have enough range.

    She is solid, but loses to V-Sak and V-Aku very badly in my opinion.

    Daniel
  • Unknown Joined:
    I wonder how long it'll be until TS posts on here. :D

    He's got the best Rose I've seen since Japan, and the best US Rose I've seen since Omar Daloney...
  • Lv.32 Z-Ism RoseLv.32 Z-Ism Rose Soul Spark! Joined: Posts: 342Registered
    I think Rose has to be very agressive in A3 to stand a chance. IMO, she can't turtle too well. Her only good AA's are only available if you have meter or if you have a V-ism charged. Her cr fierce is not very reliable for AA; neither is the Soul Throw. She is a great chracter, but she is not as good as she once was:
    Soul Illusion is rather weak now
    Can't combo of cr roundhouse (from A1 days)
    Slide isnt the best in the world (again, A1 slide was better)
    Cr fierce has virtually no horizontal range
    Lv3 Aura Soul Throw can be escaped from or damage reduced

    her virtues are:
    Lv1 Aura Soul throw is a very good anti air
    cr. strong :D
    Far Fierce and roundhouse are decent long distance pokes
    Very good cross up forward
    Best dressed in the game :lol:

    I don't know too much about her V-Ism combos, but they cant be too bad. Anybody have any good strats for her? Please post them!
    Anybody know where you can find good Rose tourney (or combo) footage?
    SFA3: V-Cammy, A-Rose, A-Zangief (pad)
    SF3-3S: Hugo (SA1) stick, Yang (SA2) pad, Ryu (SA1)

    Pad>Sticks :lol:
  • Unknown Joined:
    iirc,
    - i've heard Rose's slide in A1 was pretty abusable, and being one of the top 4 in A2, i don't think comparing her to her previous versions is fair..
    - Aura Soul Throw only escapable on PS version. everything can be damage reduced.

    opinions;
    - c.FP is not bad. i think everyone hates it coz they think it should smack jump ins like a DP. just like with shotos, anti crossup and early walk-under anti-air. mix it up with stand jab or stand strong xx soul throw, and c.SP to screw with the depth of the air attacks.
    - soul throw is unrealistic as anti-air by itself. anti air is JP (or SP) xx soul throw, or c.FP xx soul throw.
    - did anyone mention her crouch cancel corner combos? like j.JP (counterhit) > ccj.FP > c.SP > FP.reflect > c.JP > FP.soul throw.
    - cross up is VERY good. range on c.SP is amazing too. i think crossup FK, c.JP, c.SK, c.SP xx SK.drill is pretty safe GC...

    btw, what's Rose's optimum range...?
  • Unknown Joined:
    Originally posted by d_chang
    I use rose a lot in A3, and I'm sorry to say she is kind of one dimensional. I think she has a really bad match against V-Sak because c.strong doesn't have enough range.

    She is solid, but loses to V-Sak and V-Aku very badly in my opinion.

    Daniel

    abuse her cr rh and slide a lot against v sak its not that hard of a match up
  • StrikeStrike Joined: Posts: 78Registered
    Max range crouching MP xx LK Soul Spiral is safe. If crouching MP is blocked up close, do a standing LK xx LK Soul Spiral to safely tick and bait the sweep. Sets up for Level 3 Aura Soul Throw very nicely.
  • TSTS pbbbbbbt... Joined: Posts: 3,670Registered
    Originally posted by Gunter
    I wonder how long it'll be until TS posts on here. :D

    He's got the best Rose I've seen since Japan, and the best US Rose I've seen since Omar Daloney...

    Jesus. :o Thanks, but I'm all scrubby in A3 now...guess I have to get good again, so people can understand what you're talking about. Nuts.
    Originally posted by SaBrE
    heres some advice, learn to use periods "." so i can breathe when reading. <----
    Originally posted by EvilRyu10585
    perhaps 1 day

    :lol:
    "as long as it's his dog, anybody that believes in civil liberties should defend a man that just wants to fuck his dog in the privacy of his own home."
    -thurst
  • TSTS pbbbbbbt... Joined: Posts: 3,670Registered
    Would've responded sooner but was away from the net during the weekend...
    Lv.32 Z-Ism Rose and ballpoint covered pretty much everything. So random things:
    • You REALLY could have posted this on the A3 thread that's already up. :) Nah, just messing with ya...
    • As for good tourney footage of Rose, it's a rule that whenever I'm at a tourney with cameras, and am doing well, nobody will be taping me. I believe it has something to do with the Devil, I'm not sure. But for combo stuff, you might wanna try and track down one of James Chen's A3 videos, or the old Fighters.net A3 Rose video, or the BAS' V-ISM stuff.
    • Even if you can't crouch cancel, Rose gets stupid combos...counter hit jump Jab (or Strong, or Forward, or Fierce, etc), they flip, and you get to Soul Throw or Aura Soul Throw them.
    • X, A, and V-ISM Rose are all COMPLETELY DIFFERENT CHARACTERS. A-ISM likes her various levels of supers quite a bit, X-ISM just does damage, and V-ISM is as different a character as you can possibly be while having all of the same normals.
    • I like standing far Strong (xx Soul Throw) for anti-air, or standing Jab if I can't get that to work. Crouching Fierce is okay, but I'm too lazy to find out what it beats and what it doesn't, so neh.
    • Vs some characters you can get a repeated crossup pattern...deep Short Soul Spiral, crossup jump forward, crouching Strong, repeat. Only works on a couple people though
    • Rose can jump in empty with her Fierce, and it's a nice move to have. What you do is knock them down, and then jump at them with Fierce to bait anti air, or a VC. If you hit Fierce late enough, it won't hit...so if timed correctly, their DP or anti-air VC will be wasted, and they will have left themselves open, because tripguard will have saved you, and you can block, even if you were in the air during the freeze frame. If they catch on and do nothing, you can throw them.
    • Standing far Forward is a good move. Goes over sweeps and stuff. Nice priority also. Also, if you do two in a row, it changes color. Ditto with her Strong and Fierce Soul Reflects, and a few of her other moves. Just thought I'd throw that in there for no reason...
    • Other good moves are crouching Short, crouching Forward, and standing close Roundhouse...used as anti air to hit them on their way up. Not TERRIBLY useful, but nice to have around. Slide is good for when people try to cross you up without having knocked you down first, like Chun Li and Sakura will sometimes try to do. Sweep has helluva range, but is a little slow. Jump Short can be good...think CvS Vice, only with regular throws instead of supers. Also the only jumpin she has that beats Chun Li's crouching Roundhouse (not counting V-ISM activation). Jumping neutral Forward is NICE, ditto that with Fierce. I need to use standing far Fierce more often, I remember it having nice priority...
    • This is A3, so most people Alpha Counters suck... Rose's are okay, I guess. A-ISM one is basically only good for getting out of the corner. Of course it is not the ideal use of meter. For stopping VCs, also. V-ISM one, being her crouching Roundhouse, has crazy range, and you can get a crossup off of it, depending on distance. It can be PP flipped out of though (backwards flip), but you can Soul Throw them if they do flip. You have to know they're gonna flip though, because otherwise it's just sort of a waste of a crossup opportunity.
    • Soul Throw is indeed unrealistic as anti-air by itself. You can only really use it by itself, if you know what's going to happen...Vega likes to jump, and has one of the biggest ones in the game, so durr, use it when you know he's going to jump. You just hit someone with a counter hit crouching Fierce or jumping Forward, and you know they're going to flip, so...etc. Also can be used after VCs...after the last hit, let them flip, and you get to Soul Throw them.
    • Speaking of which, Soul Throw gets stopped by most characters jumping Short, but they don't know that, so you get to use it anyway. Or you can just use a super, or combo into it anyway.
    • As for Rose's optimum range... I think V-ISM likes to be about crouching Forward range, give or take. A-ISM a little further (at least sometimes), so you can see those jumpins coming, and super them if you can't beat their jumpins with any of your normals (like vs Chun Li or Sakura). God I wish Soul Illusion was good like in A2. I love that super... :depress: In A3, it's really only any good if you have them either knocked down, or in the corner. Anyway, X I think has to be a little more agressive, since she has to force a mistake sometimes. Though it's not that hard, considering how great her super is. A and V both have okay games from her sweep range (like a Zangief sized character or so) and a little further, but I think ideal range is that or a little closer. Sort of depends on the match, too.
    • You can be swept after a Short Soul Spiral, from most ranges, by Sakura, Chun Li, and I think Gief and a few other characters. You can certainly be reversal supered by anything that moves toward you fast enough...Senretsu Kyaku, Guy's kick super, Honda headbut super, etc. A majority of the time though, it's a good move to follow up a crouching Strong or other poke with.
    • VS people who's jumpins you can't beat like Sak or Chun Li, and if you don't want to spend your meter, you can either try to hit them with an early close Roundhouse (obviously much easier in V-ISM), or you can try to jump throw them. The throw thing sort of applies to everyone in A3, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.
    • Fierce Soul Reflect actually does more damage to the GC meter than the Soul Spirals will, so if you ever get a blocked crossup, keep in mind that crouching Strong, Fierce Reflect is safe if you're close enough.
    • Towards+Roundhouse ("Soul Piette") seems to have a lot of priority (especially vs jumpins which seem otherwise unbeatable), but you have to make sure not to get crossed up, because it moves her forward after you do the move.
    • Match vs V-Sak isn't that bad, you just have to not get rushed down (ie watch for throws, and the subsequent crossups that come from being thrown by Sak). It's a little rougher for A-Rose than V IMO, but it's not so bad. You can land the super(s) on her, and Crouching Strong will beat most of Sak's ground stuff, you just have to be careful, and use your supers wisely (I think the sooner you use the Level 3 Aura Soul Throw, the more likely you are to get hit with the VC, but that's just sort of theory fighter on my part. If you keep having to block her jumpins, you're going to keep having to block her standing Fierce, and you're eventually going to get Guard Crushed...). You want to use that empty jump Fierce when possible, to bait her into blowing her meter on a blocked anti-air VC. I don't have enough info on the match vs V-Akuma, but it's hard to call since most V-Akuma players aren't so great...they'll fall for the empty jump fierce, and get VCd or supered, and the chances of them knowing that Akuma/Rose gets crossed up if grabbed with the demon flip (punch) is basically zero...in practical terms, not a horrible fight, but not one Rose is expected to win. Not her worst fight, I don't think...I think that would be Sodom...or maybe Chun Li, though that one's not un-winnable either... If anyone wants to talk about specific matchups, I'd like to hear your thoughts, so feel free to respond...
    • Also, learn how to cancel moves on reaction to Stop Time (when the screen freezes before a super/VC). For example, you're poking at Chun Li with Crouching Strong, she supers (Senrestu Kyaku, the old super), and you can cancel into Soul throw, and take like one hit from a level 3/X-ISM super, and not have to flip. I believe you can also Soul Throw out of some crossups but you have to be careful with that, and be sure which direction to try it vs what crossups and when.
    • There's an unblockable glitch thing I was working on at one time for V-ISM Rose...her VC startup time is 1 frame on the ground, which is the shortest in the game, and so it's sort of randomly unblockable (ie you hit people out of their walking backwards animation like in the 1-frame supers in the VS games, if they weren't holding away BEFORE the screen freezes). Seriously, I will cheat my ass off if I find a way to do this consistently, so everyone wish me luck (or not, depending). And just as a bit of trivia, her VC activation time in the air is HORRIBLE. Entirely too long. I guess that's the tradeoff...

    Whoo..that post was a little longer than I thought it'd be...
    "as long as it's his dog, anybody that believes in civil liberties should defend a man that just wants to fuck his dog in the privacy of his own home."
    -thurst
  • Unknown Joined:
    I love this thread...

    Daniel
  • Lv.32 Z-Ism RoseLv.32 Z-Ism Rose Soul Spark! Joined: Posts: 342Registered
    How reliable is her strong/fierce soul spark in terms of pushing somebody away from you? It always seems to push them a good distance away whether blocked or hit, but I wasnt sure if it had any major uses because of that.
    SFA3: V-Cammy, A-Rose, A-Zangief (pad)
    SF3-3S: Hugo (SA1) stick, Yang (SA2) pad, Ryu (SA1)

    Pad>Sticks :lol:
  • Unknown Joined:
    I'm not sure how reliable it is...

    But I'v been having trouble connecting c.forward into jab soul spark... any tips? It just doesn't seem to connect for me.

    Also, anti air jab xx fierce soul throw is good. I like it more than c. fierce now. I think that will make me switch to v-ism.

    I'm also having trouble connect c.strong xx fierce soul reflect, c.strong/s.strong xx soul throw. The soul throw seems to miss half of the time, but I can't figure out why. I think if I switch the second strong for c.fierce then it connects more consistently, but c.fierce has so little horizontal range that it becomes harder to connect that. Any tips?

    My 2 cents on Rose is that she is good at getting that guard meter down. I was looking at the All About Zero 3 book (if only I could read Japanese) but it seems that they have a sequence with Rose that goes ... c.strong, c.foward, roundhouse (the far reaching one). It works for me to some extent, but sometimes people can jump out. Maybe s.forward would work better? Any thoughts?

    On a similar note, how useful is s.forward?

    Daniel
  • gbursinegbursine TeaPire! Joined: Posts: 1,725Registered
    wasn't rose top tier at one point??
    play vampire :P

    Brawl info: New Jersey - 0430-8044-3987
  • Unknown Joined:
    Originally posted by TS
    Would've responded sooner but was away from the net during the weekend...
    Lv.32 Z-Ism Rose and ballpoint covered pretty much everything. So random things:

    • You REALLY could have posted this on the A3 thread that's already up. :) Nah, just messing with ya...
    • As for good tourney footage of Rose, it's a rule that whenever I'm at a tourney with cameras, and am doing well, nobody will be taping me. I believe it has something to do with the Devil, I'm not sure. But for combo stuff, you might wanna try and track down one of James Chen's A3 videos, or the old Fighters.net A3 Rose video, or the BAS' V-ISM stuff.
    • Even if you can't crouch cancel, Rose gets stupid combos...counter hit jump Jab (or Strong, or Forward, or Fierce, etc), they flip, and you get to Soul Throw or Aura Soul Throw them.
    • X, A, and V-ISM Rose are all COMPLETELY DIFFERENT CHARACTERS. A-ISM likes her various levels of supers quite a bit, X-ISM just does damage, and V-ISM is as different a character as you can possibly be while having all of the same normals.
    • I like standing far Strong (xx Soul Throw) for anti-air, or standing Jab if I can't get that to work. Crouching Fierce is okay, but I'm too lazy to find out what it beats and what it doesn't, so neh.
    • Vs some characters you can get a repeated crossup pattern...deep Short Soul Spiral, crossup jump forward, crouching Strong, repeat. Only works on a couple people though
    • Rose can jump in empty with her Fierce, and it's a nice move to have. What you do is knock them down, and then jump at them with Fierce to bait anti air, or a VC. If you hit Fierce late enough, it won't hit...so if timed correctly, their DP or anti-air VC will be wasted, and they will have left themselves open, because tripguard will have saved you, and you can block, even if you were in the air during the freeze frame. If they catch on and do nothing, you can throw them.
    • Standing far Forward is a good move. Goes over sweeps and stuff. Nice priority also. Also, if you do two in a row, it changes color. Ditto with her Strong and Fierce Soul Reflects, and a few of her other moves. Just thought I'd throw that in there for no reason...
    • Other good moves are crouching Short, crouching Forward, and standing close Roundhouse...used as anti air to hit them on their way up. Not TERRIBLY useful, but nice to have around. Slide is good for when people try to cross you up without having knocked you down first, like Chun Li and Sakura will sometimes try to do. Sweep has helluva range, but is a little slow. Jump Short can be good...think CvS Vice, only with regular throws instead of supers. Also the only jumpin she has that beats Chun Li's crouching Roundhouse (not counting V-ISM activation). Jumping neutral Forward is NICE, ditto that with Fierce. I need to use standing far Fierce more often, I remember it having nice priority...
    • This is A3, so most people Alpha Counters suck... Rose's are okay, I guess. A-ISM one is basically only good for getting out of the corner. Of course it is not the ideal use of meter. For stopping VCs, also. V-ISM one, being her crouching Roundhouse, has crazy range, and you can get a crossup off of it, depending on distance. It can be PP flipped out of though (backwards flip), but you can Soul Throw them if they do flip. You have to know they're gonna flip though, because otherwise it's just sort of a waste of a crossup opportunity.
    • Soul Throw is indeed unrealistic as anti-air by itself. You can only really use it by itself, if you know what's going to happen...Vega likes to jump, and has one of the biggest ones in the game, so durr, use it when you know he's going to jump. You just hit someone with a counter hit crouching Fierce or jumping Forward, and you know they're going to flip, so...etc. Also can be used after VCs...after the last hit, let them flip, and you get to Soul Throw them.
    • Speaking of which, Soul Throw gets stopped by most characters jumping Short, but they don't know that, so you get to use it anyway. Or you can just use a super, or combo into it anyway.
    • As for Rose's optimum range... I think V-ISM likes to be about crouching Forward range, give or take. A-ISM a little further (at least sometimes), so you can see those jumpins coming, and super them if you can't beat their jumpins with any of your normals (like vs Chun Li or Sakura). God I wish Soul Illusion was good like in A2. I love that super... :depress: In A3, it's really only any good if you have them either knocked down, or in the corner. Anyway, X I think has to be a little more agressive, since she has to force a mistake sometimes. Though it's not that hard, considering how great her super is. A and V both have okay games from her sweep range (like a Zangief sized character or so) and a little further, but I think ideal range is that or a little closer. Sort of depends on the match, too.
    • You can be swept after a Short Soul Spiral, from most ranges, by Sakura, Chun Li, and I think Gief and a few other characters. You can certainly be reversal supered by anything that moves toward you fast enough...Senretsu Kyaku, Guy's kick super, Honda headbut super, etc. A majority of the time though, it's a good move to follow up a crouching Strong or other poke with.
    • VS people who's jumpins you can't beat like Sak or Chun Li, and if you don't want to spend your meter, you can either try to hit them with an early close Roundhouse (obviously much easier in V-ISM), or you can try to jump throw them. The throw thing sort of applies to everyone in A3, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.
    • Fierce Soul Reflect actually does more damage to the GC meter than the Soul Spirals will, so if you ever get a blocked crossup, keep in mind that crouching Strong, Fierce Reflect is safe if you're close enough.
    • Towards+Roundhouse ("Soul Piette") seems to have a lot of priority (especially vs jumpins which seem otherwise unbeatable), but you have to make sure not to get crossed up, because it moves her forward after you do the move.
    • Match vs V-Sak isn't that bad, you just have to not get rushed down (ie watch for throws, and the subsequent crossups that come from being thrown by Sak). It's a little rougher for A-Rose than V IMO, but it's not so bad. You can land the super(s) on her, and Crouching Strong will beat most of Sak's ground stuff, you just have to be careful, and use your supers wisely (I think the sooner you use the Level 3 Aura Soul Throw, the more likely you are to get hit with the VC, but that's just sort of theory fighter on my part. If you keep having to block her jumpins, you're going to keep having to block her standing Fierce, and you're eventually going to get Guard Crushed...). You want to use that empty jump Fierce when possible, to bait her into blowing her meter on a blocked anti-air VC. I don't have enough info on the match vs V-Akuma, but it's hard to call since most V-Akuma players aren't so great...they'll fall for the empty jump fierce, and get VCd or supered, and the chances of them knowing that Akuma/Rose gets crossed up if grabbed with the demon flip (punch) is basically zero...in practical terms, not a horrible fight, but not one Rose is expected to win. Not her worst fight, I don't think...I think that would be Sodom...or maybe Chun Li, though that one's not un-winnable either... If anyone wants to talk about specific matchups, I'd like to hear your thoughts, so feel free to respond...
    • Also, learn how to cancel moves on reaction to Stop Time (when the screen freezes before a super/VC). For example, you're poking at Chun Li with Crouching Strong, she supers (Senrestu Kyaku, the old super), and you can cancel into Soul throw, and take like one hit from a level 3/X-ISM super, and not have to flip. I believe you can also Soul Throw out of some crossups but you have to be careful with that, and be sure which direction to try it vs what crossups and when.
    • There's an unblockable glitch thing I was working on at one time for V-ISM Rose...her VC startup time is 1 frame on the ground, which is the shortest in the game, and so it's sort of randomly unblockable (ie you hit people out of their walking backwards animation like in the 1-frame supers in the VS games, if they weren't holding away BEFORE the screen freezes). Seriously, I will cheat my ass off if I find a way to do this consistently, so everyone wish me luck (or not, depending). And just as a bit of trivia, her VC activation time in the air is HORRIBLE. Entirely too long. I guess that's the tradeoff...

    Whoo..that post was a little longer than I thought it'd be...



    thanks a lot for the insightful post does stand jab really work for anti air? down fierce is really good for aa it stops chun jumping short and vega jump rh do you have any use for her soul illlusion suiper?
  • StrikeStrike Joined: Posts: 78Registered
    Originally posted by EvilRyu10585




    down fierce is really good for aa it stops chun jumping short and vega jump rh

    Rose's crouching fierce beating Chun's jumping short? Ha, I think you're confusing SFA2 with SFA3.
  • Unknown Joined:
    d_chang:

    Comboing the soul spark is pretty unpredictable, not to mention flat-out dangerous against a cornered opponent. It's simply not worth it. Try using spiral instead for combos.

    Comboing a soul throw from a crouching FP is really more reliable than SP, not because of any special properties on crouching FP's part, but because in order to use it poperly your positioning was better than when you'd use a crouching SP (er, did that make sense?). To put it another way: you're using crouching SP from further away than you'd use crouching FP, so naturally the sould throw (which also has almost 0 horizontal range) would miss.

    Yup, Rose can wear a guard meter down. All of it's good (ending with RK and whatnot) -- varying the sequence all has uses.

    Standing FK is useful if your opponent likes footsies with crouching kicks (such as Ryu's crouching FK). However, Rose's optimal range is a bit outside the standing FK range, so unless your opponent is so dense that he keeps on persisting on doing crouching FK you won't get much mileage from this move.
  • bison812bison812 East Coast Player Joined: Posts: 140Registered
    In A2 she was a GODDESS Omar Daloney out of Va played her. Sick man very sick in A3 she is decent character to use but read the TS stuff. Some very interesting things about ROSE i did not know. My question is what Ism should be use in to very effective or does it all depend on the player.
    Bison812-
    Scream! Cry out! Suffer till your hearts content

    The best post i've ever read on SRK

    Understand that other ppl here on SRK or in Japan can be wrong. This means that while a character may be viewed as weak, he/she can win at the highest levels. It comes down to the player unless the matches are so against the character that ppl think of them like Dan.

    Sure, it may not be true 100% but in trying to be good and innovate new shit instead of being a skillful copycat, it's good to assume that every character is competitive at a certain level.

    -Apoc
  • TSTS pbbbbbbt... Joined: Posts: 3,670Registered
    2 more of my cents:

    Combos into Soul Spark are generally not worth it. As a matter of fact, the only use I can think of for Soul Spark at all is tossing it out in projectile wars from across the screen, to stop any mind games someone may be trying to play by throwing slow projectiles (expecting you to reflect them).

    As for the actual combo though, Soul Sparks have a lot startup time, so you either need a counter hit low forward, or need to be closer than you are.
    Originally posted by d_chang

    I'm also having trouble connect c.strong xx fierce soul reflect, c.strong/s.strong xx soul throw. The soul throw seems to miss half of the time, but I can't figure out why. I think if I switch the second strong for c.fierce then it connects more consistently, but c.fierce has so little horizontal range that it becomes harder to connect that. Any tips?
    At first I though you meant you were having trouble connecting crouching/standing Strong xx Soul Throw, which has never missed for me as anti air, so I wasn't sure what you were talking about...then I realized you meant the whole combo.

    First of all, that combo is flippable (after the Soul Reflect), but that's okay, since if you know they're gonna flip, you can just Soul Throw them and get them anyway. Also, they probably won't flip, as you have to flip backwards to get out of it, and most people tend to flip neutral for some reason I can't figure out.

    Anyhow, depends on the character and the timing, mostly. For example, it's harder to land on shotos than on Gief, because he's bigger. The timing part is that you need to have that Strong (crouching Jab is actually the easiest way to do it, though it also works with close standing Fierce, which is hard for A/X Rose to do) come out ASAP. Other combo that I was messing around with at one point was [crouching Strong, FP Reflect]x2. Soul Reflect does more dizzy, and a tiny bit more damge than Roundhouse Soul Spiral, which is what I used at first, and does close to the same damage as combo into Soul Throw, which is what I moved onto from the Spiral. Good thing about that combo is also that they can neutral flip from it, so you get to Soul Throw them when they do, or just hit them with close standing Roundhouse, or standing Forward, or standing Strong into Soul Throw, etc.

    Yes, Rose does pretty well at breaking that Guard meter. That's actually the only thing I've found Soul Illusion to be useful for, actually...crouching Strong xx Level 1 Soul Illusion, Crouching Roundhouse, crossup, poke away. Can't figure out why that links...I guess instead of just stopping time, Soul Illusion actually gives you a frame advantage, or something. Even though it obviously doesn't...hm.
    Originally posted by d_chang
    Also, anti air jab xx fierce soul throw is good. I like it more than c. fierce now. I think that will make me switch to v-ism.
    Whuh?
    Originally posted by Lv.32 Z-Ism Rose
    How reliable is her strong/fierce soul spark in terms of pushing somebody away from you? It always seems to push them a good distance away whether blocked or hit, but I wasnt sure if it had any major uses because of that.

    Well the thing there is that if you push them away, they're out of of crouching Strong range, and also you can't super them or anything for mistakes they might make. Then agian, I suppose a lot of people would jump after being pushed away, so that's something.
    Originally posted by gbursine
    wasn't rose top tier at one point??

    Not in Alpha 3, now. X-Rose was considered pretty good, because she does nice damage, and has a good priority and a great super. Then V-ISM came along (and used in conjunction with better characters than Honda) and she was sorta forgotten.
    Originally posted by EvilRyu10585

    thanks a lot for the insightful post does stand jab really work for anti air? down fierce is really good for aa it stops chun jumping short and vega jump rh do you have any use for her soul illlusion suiper?

    Thanks, and yes, standing Jab is good anti-air. Crouching Fierce works better, depending on the situation. Vs Gief, it's not such a great idea, for example. Both lose to Chun Li's jumping Short in most situations, at least in the arcade/Saturn versions. Soul Illusion super is not so great. Good for a little extra whittling down of the GC guage, but not much else. Some small confusion stuff, I guess. Sweep them, and do crossup Forward that allows you to land without being anti-aired. The last image from the Soul Illusion will hit them if they try to do anything. You can do the same thing with pokes as they get up...sort of like her A2 unblockables, only much, much less useful. Or you could do crossup Forward as they get up (or just do a jumpin) and then do low Short or Forward when you land, and hope they guess wrong. Either way, you get some GC damage, which is nice. Man, I really wish that super was better...

    gotta go...

    bison812- X-ISM is probably the easiest, just because of the super and the damage. I like V best, just because I've never seen anyone else use it, aside from the CPU. Have to see some of those Japan vids one day... A-ISM is probably the second easiest, if you can manage your meter well. Level 1 supers at the right time and all that...
    "as long as it's his dog, anybody that believes in civil liberties should defend a man that just wants to fuck his dog in the privacy of his own home."
    -thurst
  • bison812bison812 East Coast Player Joined: Posts: 140Registered
    Thanks TS i knew she was deadly in A2. I think capcom tone her down a little in A3. If it has not been mention what are some of her best pokes and anti-air. What special are worth using and what kind of proirity does her super have.
    Bison812-
    Scream! Cry out! Suffer till your hearts content

    The best post i've ever read on SRK

    Understand that other ppl here on SRK or in Japan can be wrong. This means that while a character may be viewed as weak, he/she can win at the highest levels. It comes down to the player unless the matches are so against the character that ppl think of them like Dan.

    Sure, it may not be true 100% but in trying to be good and innovate new shit instead of being a skillful copycat, it's good to assume that every character is competitive at a certain level.

    -Apoc
  • Unknown Joined:
    What are some good VC's for rose?

    Specifically, what are good anti-ait VC's if she has any.

    Any thing would help.

    Thanks

    Daniel
  • TSTS pbbbbbbt... Joined: Posts: 3,670Registered
    Sorry for the lateness...

    Most damaging midscreen for Rose is VC3, crouching Strong, Short Soul Spiral, [b+FP, whiff Short Spiral]xn until meter runs out, and then you can let them flip and get them with a Soul Throw for more damage, if you want. If they hit the corner before the VC ends, just do [b+FP, whiff Jab Soul Reflect (or whiff Soul Spark)] until meter runs out. You may not want to Soul Throw them there, as it may not be worth the damage to be cornered. Better off going for an air throw (which is flippable), or letting them flip and trying to get a crouch cancel.

    Corner VCs would be the one I listed after the midscreen (does most damage in VC1, I think), and also VC2, [crouching Strong, Short Soul Spiral] until V-ISM runs out. All Spirals after the first will usually whiff. VC is not so great (only does like 40% damage), but Dhalsim can't recover out of it, and it looks sorta pretty since the Strongs hit twice. Doesn't work vs characters who are too normal-sized...ARK, Dan, Rose, Guy, and Rolento(?). You can also whiff Jab Soul Reflects after the second Strong, and I think that works vs everyone (but again, not the most damaging thing you can do in the corner).

    She has some other random VCs, but I guess I'll just go to anti-air. Anti-air VCs are

    1. VC1/2, Jab Soul Reflect, [whiff Short Soul Spiral, b+Fierce]xn...same as the midscreen. VC should only be used if you can blow through the opponent's attack with the VC activation, as Jab Soul Reflect isn't quite crazy with the priority. So if something is going to hit late or deep (ie Charlie's jumping Roundhouse), you don't get to use this one.

    2. VC1/2/3, Strong Soul Reflect, same as above. Strong Reflect has better priority (though it's still not perfect), so you do this VC ahead of time, to hit them out of whatever they're doing.

    Okay, ONE random VC, just because it looks pretty.
    VC1, Crouching Strong, Short Soul Spiral, [standing Fierce (neutral), whiff Short Soul Spiral)xn. So cute... Less damage though.
    "as long as it's his dog, anybody that believes in civil liberties should defend a man that just wants to fuck his dog in the privacy of his own home."
    -thurst
  • Unknown Joined:
    HELLO ALL! im back:)

    if you want, i can make a technical video for lot of character (when start OC, how to escape OC, etc..). then, there will be post on www.thelemmings.net.

    please, tell me what kind of strategy you want in it. (i already have some idea. but tell me what you think about).

    ps: there were too much post...i couldnt read them all T.T

    Ill post this message on all character's thread.


    ps2: maybe it would be good to create a new thread "A3 technical idea" with all your ideas. then, i wont have to check every thread to see what you wrote;)
  • TSTS pbbbbbbt... Joined: Posts: 3,670Registered
    Random update.

    Wow, old thread. Um, just wanted to make note that Rose's t+RK move in A/V-ISM is actually called the Soul Piede, and not the Piette. Piette is a mistranslation which showed up in the late Kao Megura's SFA3 FAQ, and was stolen and even shows up in the DC version of SFA3 under Rose's movelist. Piede is Italian for "foot" or I guess sometimes "kick." Been meaning to get around to mentioning that like forever. I'm still gonna call the DP+P move the Soul Throw, even though the translation is Soul Thru, because Soul Thru (Through) doesn't make any god damn sense.

    Some A-Rose stuff here: http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1658243&postcount=190
    and Xenozip's combo here
    http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1706278&postcount=16

    V-Rose FAQ still not updated for a while but can be found at
    http://anubis916.freeservers.com/Rosie and is whichever file is the most recently updated- in this case it's named "V-ISM_~4.TXT" Working on misc. things for next update, like some damage figures, win quotes etc. Should probably give the VS section a looking-over also, but considering how long it's been since I've played anyone (When was NorCal regionals 2? February?), it's probably best that I don't.
    "as long as it's his dog, anybody that believes in civil liberties should defend a man that just wants to fuck his dog in the privacy of his own home."
    -thurst
  • Unknown Joined:
    i believed that rose should be a defensive player.. i've been playing with rose for who knows when, and i think that defensive play is the best. her moves are pretty laggy in a sense that opponents can chop her. eg her HK drill.. very laggy. so yeah...

    defence is the way to go
  • Unknown Joined:
    Yeah I remember Omar's Rose- damn scary stuff. a lot of the NC crew played Rose for a bit in A2 and A3 after he did some ownage on a lot of the NC players, including myself.

    Those were my newb days also.
    I remember at least two or three tourney finals were him vs Jason.
  • Xenozip.Xenozip. what a nincowpoop Joined: Posts: 3,942Registered
    Two year old thread. :o

    I'm so glad you mentioned that, though. I've been wondering WTF "piette" was for the longest time. Soul Foot, hahaha, awesome.

    I think I slightly modified that cross-up string, BTW. And there are several variations to the A-ism CC/dizzy combo.

    Also, I dunno if this post has any use: http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1656260&postcount=184
    Let's play.
  • Iczer oneIczer one chillin' at Buxi Bar Joined: Posts: 216Registered
    lvl.1 Soul Illusion - where the magic happens ...

    Damn, this topic is old ... and still too short :P

    Since there's not much to find here about soul illusion, i will post some things i know about it. It's awesome, that's for sure :tup: don't hate it because the super doesn't work like in A2, it's still pretty dangerous.



    [general link combos]

    Rose can link a lot of stuff while the illusions are activated, here are some of the most useful ones ...


    - c.short -> c.forward xx qcf roundhouse (13 hits, 31 damage, 7 chip)
    - c.short -> c.strong xx qcf roundhouse (13 hits, 32 damage, 7 chip)
    => linking into the strong does a bit more damage, c.forward has more range though


    - crossup j.forward, c.short -> c.strong xx qcf roundhouse (16 hits, 39 damage, 7 chip)


    - c.strong xx qcf x2 short -> c.roundhouse, crossup j.forward, c.short -> c.strong xx qcf roundhouse
    (2 hits + 16 hits, 24 + 39 = 63 damage, 7 chip)
    => you can cut the recovery of the strong and link into the sweep, a perfect setup for her illusion crossup madness (it's very hard to escape that combo, even with a reversal super, the illusions are like a shield)



    [lvl.2 Aura Soul Spark]


    - (corner) meaty c.strong -> c.strong xx qcb x2 strong (14 hits, 36 damage, 10 chip)
    => flashy, but not worth it


    - c.short -> c.strong xx qcb x2 strong (16 hits, 47 damage, 10 chip)
    - c.short xx qcb strong (16 hits, 56 damage, 13 chip)
    => it does more damage if you don't link into the strong and cancel the super directly from the short


    - crossup j.forward, c.short xx qcb x2 strong (19 hits, 60 damage, 13 chip)
    => easy hit confirm into the super, damage is not the best so only do it if it wins you the round



    [corner madness, feat. lvl.2 Aura Soul Throw]

    NOW we're talking :karate: this is why it is one of Rose's main goals to get the opponent into the corner, she can deal good damage in many ways, is safe while pressuring the opponent (illusion gives you advantage on pretty much all of her pokes) and can deal a lot of guard damage.


    - (corner) c.strong xx qcb fierce (opponent flips), instant j.fierce (catches them), (land) c.strong xx qcb strong/fierce
    (6 hits + 7/8 hits, 27+40 = 67 damage)
    - (corner) c.strong xx qcb fierce (opponent does not flip), instant j.fierce, (land) c.strong xx qcb strong
    (14 hits, 60 damage)
    => this combo is HARD to escape even if they flip, when the oppenent performs a back flip you sometimes switch sides when you come down from the j.fierce, so keep that in mind


    - (corner) c.strong xx qcb fierce, instant j.fierce, (land) c.strong xx qcb strong, (otg) qcf x2 strong
    (14 hits + throw, 74 damage)
    => this looks funny, the throw part of the super otg's, it's a combo [console versions only]


    - (corner) c.strong xx qcb fierce, instant j.fierce, (land) c.strong xx qcf x2 strong
    (17/18 hits + throw, 81/80 damage, 70/69 if they KK ground roll escape the throw [console versions only] )


    - (corner) c.strong xx qcb fierce (blocked), df forward slide, ...
    --> (walk forward a little bit) c.forward xx qcf roundhouse (~ 50% guard damage, ~ 7 chip)
    --> j.forward, c.strong xx qcf roundhouse (~60% guard damage, ~ 7 chip)
    --> (...)
    => if they block your attempt to launch them keep the pressure going, Rose can do some really good guard damage (even more than she usually does) with the illusions activated, and things like the slide are much safer
    always coming back
  • TSTS pbbbbbbt... Joined: Posts: 3,670Registered
    AFAIK the Level 2 Aura Soul Throw only OTGs on the console versions. You can option select it, IIRC, even without a Soul Illusion before hand- in the corner, crouching Strong xx FP Soul Reflect, crouching Jab xx super.

    Another option select is with the Soul Reflect is doing it 3 times...ie Jumping Fierce, [crouching Strong xx FP Soul Reflect]x2, Crouching strong (whiff or connect) xx FP or SP Soul Reflect. They can't do a neutral air recovery after the first one, so they may be hit by the second crouching Strong into reflect...they CAN do a neutral air recover after the second one, so sometimes they get themselves caught. I'm pretty sure if they air recover toward you, you can still catch them with whiff crouhcing Strong into the Reflect, or maybe even hit them with the crouching Strong...the forward PP flip is quicker than the backwards and neutral ones. The combo at the start of the paragraph does about 32 points of dizzy, and most characters dizzy after 40 points, so they're pretty close to being dizzy after that after a few more random hits. Also, Counter Hits do 25% more stun, so if the jumping Fierce is a counter hit or you can hit them out of moves with pokes before/afterward, they're in pretty bad shape.

    You may be able to just do crouching Jab or Strong xx Strong Reflect, as the SP version of the move does the same dizzy and has a higher attack box, but is slower. Also, you can just wait to see if they air recover after the second Reflect and do an Aura Soul Throw, of course. That's pretty much always an option. Or you can do crouching Strong xx Lvl 1 Illusion after the first Reflect, and if they air recover you can super, unblockable if not. Or, just Illusion right after the FP Reflect and do c.SP xx whatever if they don't air recover, and super on reaction or option select C.SP or S.JP xx super if they do. You can option select the Level 2 Aura Soul Throw OTG on the console versions (-Saturn, I think) after...an OTG isn't a juggle, and therefore you can OTG even after the juggle limiter is active.

    And then, no matter how they're hit, you can do an unblockable (and hit confirm) if they don't do a ground recovery (KK roll). Even then, you can hit them out of it if they do. I should mention that the SP Reflect is mostly for juggling only, and you can't really combo afterwards most of the time. So c.SP xx FP Reflect, c.JP xx SP Reflect is somewhat more guaranteed, but cuts down on your damage/dizzy potential, because they have less time to flip afterwards, and you'd think they'd be less likely to, but that depends. s/c.JP cancels work better to SP Reflct, since it's slower.


    About the Soul Illusion, two crossup things I like...c.SP xx Illusion, crossup jumping FK, crouching Jab, Crouching SP, slide. Safe, but they can Alpha Counter out of it, I'm sure. After the slide (and I'm assuming this is blocked), you can do Level 2 Aura Soul Spark/Throw if they try to do anything, or continue to poke...I think you can get another Soul Illusion going, too, but I really haven't worked that out (would be something like walk forward, crouching Jab, crouhcing Strong xx Illusion, slide or whatever)...you don't get frame advantage after the slide anyway, you just recover at about the same time. Secondly, there's Soul Illusion, crossup j.FK, crouching JPx3 xx Level 2 Aura Soul Reflect...does about 20 hits IIRC, and close to 50% damage...and looks nice. I don't know if it works on smaller characters (I'd guess not), but I remember it works on Blanka.

    3 more quick notes about the Soul Illusion: a normal attack (far standing Strong works best, followed by crouching Strong) will interrupt any VC that doesn't start with an invulnerable special move/quick command throw. Even so, if it's an invulnerable attack which hits more than once or slows down after a hit (ie Akuma Dp, Ken FP DP, Sagat SP/FP Dps, etc), they get hit out of it by the shadow o the Illusion, so keep that in mind. If you think they're going to burn the meter, you can do far standing Strong as they're getting up or something, and let them reversal it. I think it also works vs single-hit DPs, but I honestly don't remember, so I can't say. The exception is vs Sakura- if she activates and then does a Jab DP as soon as possible, it will get through because her activation time is shorter than most characters' (somewhat little-known fact: VC xx Jab DP with Sakura is actually unblockable after the screen pause from close range with the correct timing). Never tested vs Vega, Guy or Charlie.

    Secondly, if frame data means anything here, Soul Illusion (regardless of level) has two frames of recovery, and is vulnerable for exactly one frame. Also, it lasts for 264 frames at level 1, 384 at level 2, and 564 at level 3, or about 4.5, 6.5, and 9 seconds, respectively. At the start of the super, the shadows come out after 8 and 16 frames after an attack...I think. That sounds about right, anyway. Anyway, there's only two shadows toward the end of the move, So I'm guessing that's those, and during the start, there's another at the end...or, in the middle. Who knows....maybe the last image comes at either 8 or 16 frames? 8 sounds a little slow, actually...seems more like 4, doesn't it?

    Also, if you do Soul Illusion, and then use a Level 1 Aura Soul Throw to win the round, you get cool red and blue shadows like in SFA1. Ie, counter hit crouching SP as anti-air xx Level 1 Illusion, Level 1 Aura Soul Throw. This works on the arcade version, dunno about the various console ones.


    Also, and this post is longer than I'd thought it would be already, I'll just add that you can juggle after the Level 2 Aura Soul Spark with a far standing Roundhouse...I've done it before, but I don't remember if I had Soul Illusion activated or not. I think it's a link...I don't think it's a cancel like Ryu's hopkick. Anyway, if so, it can be air-recovered out of...but, even better, really.
    "as long as it's his dog, anybody that believes in civil liberties should defend a man that just wants to fuck his dog in the privacy of his own home."
    -thurst
  • Iczer oneIczer one chillin' at Buxi Bar Joined: Posts: 216Registered
    AFAIK the Level 2 Aura Soul Throw only OTGs on the console versions.

    You're right, I#ve tested it a minute ago in the arcarde version and it didn't worked (edited my post).
    Well i guess that it otg's is the tradeoff for also being KK ground roll escapable :wink:
    About the Soul Illusion, two crossup things I like...c.SP xx Illusion, crossup jumping FK, crouching Jab, Crouching SP, slide. Safe, but they can Alpha Counter out of it, I'm sure. After the slide (and I'm assuming this is blocked), you can do Level 2 Aura Soul Spark/Throw if they try to do anything, or continue to poke...I think you can get another Soul Illusion going, too, but I really haven't worked that out (would be something like walk forward, crouching Jab, crouhcing Strong xx Illusion, slide or whatever)...you don't get frame advantage after the slide anyway, you just recover at about the same time.

    I totally love the slide when the illusions are activated :tup: you can easily start the pressure (or even punish) from half screen away. If they jump forward you can punish from behind (c.strong xx dp fierce), if they stick something ou tthe slide will most likely beat it.
    If you play against somebody who uses an X-ism chara (i play against an X-Chun every now and then) and they're low on health, a slide -> c.short xx qcf roundhouse will do as much chip damage as a fierce attack with the illusion if blocked.
    always coming back
Sign In or Register to comment.