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UltraDavid's How-To Q Thread

UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney??Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
Just so you know before you read all this: Q is low tier. It is possible to win with him, but you have to work harder than your opponent to do so, and doing that is not easy. To help you get started, check out Thongboy Bebop?s Third Strike Basics video and StreakSRM?s introduction to Q video, Clawstrophobia, both of which are on Combovideos.com and YouTube. And remember, these are all suggestions, so if you feel you have better ones, let me know and I?ll change things around.

Post 1
Part 1: Special Moves
Part 2: Normal Attacks
-- A. Normal punches
a. Standing punches
b. Crouching punches
c. Jumping punches
-- B. Normal kicks
a. Standing kicks
b. Crouching kicks
c. Jumping kicks
-- C. Other Attacks
a. Universal overhead
b. Normal throws
Part 3: Frame Data
Part 4: Useful Combos Etc
-- A. Combos that work anywhere
-- B. Midscreen combos
-- C. Opponent almost cornered
-- D. Corner combos
-- E. Combos when Q is cornered or almost cornered
-- F. Resets into super
-- G. More (stupid) combos


Post 2
Part 5: Stuff About Q
-- A. Defense
a. Basics
b. Red parrying
c. Escaping situations
-- B. Taunts
a. Benefits
b. Setups
-- C. Supers
a. SAI
b. SAII
c. Super choice
d. Random supering
e. Canceling into super on reaction
-- D. Normals
a. Pokes
b. Meaty attacks
-- E. Capture and deadly blow
a. Usage in Q?s game
b. Setups
c. Using opponent?s fear of c&db
d. Reset vs. knockdown
e. Superjump canceling
f. Uoh ground crossup


Post 3
Part 5 Continued: More Stuff About Q
-- F. Combos
-- G. Kara canceling
a. Kara throwing
b. Kara uoh
-- H. Partitioning
-- I. Start-game strategy
-- J. End-game strategy
a. Chip kill
b. Being cautious
-- K. Random things


Post 4
Part 6: Matchup Win-Loss Expectancy
-- A. Retarded tier
-- B. Bad tier
-- C. Not-too-awful tier
-- D. Manageable tier
-- E. Fine tier
Part 7: General Notes on Matchups
-- A. Ranking process
-- B. Matchup comments
Part 8: Character-Specific Advice
-- A. Retarded tier
a. Makoto
-- B. Bad tier
a. Chun
b. Ken
c. Akuma
d. Urien
e. Yun


Post 5
Part 8: More Character-Specific Advice
-- A. Pretty hard tier
a. Ibuki
b. Elena
c. Alex
d. Oro
-- B. Not-awful tier
a. Dudley
b. Remy
c. Yang
d. Ryu
e. Necro
-- C. Fine tier
a. Q
b. Hugo
c. Twelve
d. Sean


Post 6
Part 8: Advice From Other People
Part 9: Videos


Part 1: Special Moves


Capture and deadly blow (c&db): half circle back, kick. A slow command grab that sets up very damaging combos. The stronger the kick button used, the slower the startup, the longer the range, and the farther the opponent will be launched, although the startup and range don?t differ all that much. The range is great, even longer than Hugo?s Gigas Breaker?s range. C&db is very important against certain characters and not so important against others. If you don?t follow up with an attack before the opponent lands on the ground, he cannot quick-stand.

Regular dash punch: charge back, toward, punch. The harder the punch, the farther the dash goes. The normal version is always safe on block, with the rare and negligible exception of a fierce version done against an opponent who counters with a reversal-timed 2-frame long-ranged super (so, Ken SAIII). It can be comboed into with close standing forward and out of with a super (or other stuff, if it?s the ex version) and used to cover ground quickly. Don?t get predictable with it or use it to attack too often. Note that some characters, as mentioned below, can duck/walk/dash under it. The ex version bounces the opponent off the wall and back at you, allowing a juggle.

Overhead dash punch: charge back, toward, hold punch. It?s an overhead, obviously, and it hits a little later than the regular version, so if the opponent is crouching or going for a parry it?s a little harder for them to deal with. You can link it to SAII, but only if the opponent is crouching and you do it close enough. This move can come out if you tap punch, so heads up for that. It?s punishable on block.

Low dash punch: charge back, toward, kick. This sweeps the opponent, but it?s unsafe on block and has a little longer startup than the regular dash punch. Opponents usually have no reason not to block low on a dash punch because every character can either block or duck the regular version that way, so going low isn?t useful very often. It?s mainly used as a surprise move, to beat an expected toward parry, and against opponents who can?t punish you much if it?s blocked. The ex version combos into SAI.

High-speed barrage (slaps): quarter circle back, punch. This is very useful against lots of characters. Use the jab version most often because it hits everyone even when they?re crouching. Strong slaps is a good poke and is useful if you parry an air attack, fierce slaps is a decent and situational antiair, and both can be used to keep an opponent from jumping on yours or your opponent?s wakeup. The slaps can only be punished by certain supers, including Ken SAIII, Chun SAII, Dudley SAIII, Makoto SAI, Q SAII, reversal-timed Necro SAIII, and Remy SAII, which only hits a couple times and can then be parried or blocked. Against characters who can?t punish the slaps, you can use it for poking, antiair, spacing, and chip. EX slaps knocks the opponent down, does great damage, stun, and chip, but it?s easily punished by everyone on block.


Part 2: Normal Attacks

Normal Punches

Far standing jab: This is a decent semi-poke. It comes pretty fast and has decent range, but its recovery isn?t as good as it could be and it can be ducked by most characters. It?s most often used to tick into c&db and to keep certain opponents from dashing in, but standing short is generally a better option. It can be parried high and low, even by characters whose down parries make them crouch under the actual jab.
Close standing jab: This comes out and recovers faster than far standing jab and can be canceled into all of Q?s specials, although it only comboes into ex slaps and super. Its main use is as an antiair against empty jumps and opponents who jump right in front of you, but it?s also used as an occasional tick. It can be parried high and low.
Neutral standing strong: This move has great range, is safe on block, and actually recovers better if whiffed than you?d think. It?s mainly used in c&db corner resets and to give Q his second-best karathrowing distance, but it can also serve as a preemptive antiair. It must be parried high.
Back + strong: This is one of Q?s best normals, and is useful as a poke, antiair, and karathrow. It makes Q move up a bit, and the punch actually extends over and a little behind Q?s head, so you can hit people who are over and a little behind you. It?s safe on block and has good range, so it?s good for a poke and for making sure the opponent doesn?t jump when you have him cornered. Plus, if you use it as an antiair and time it just right, you can recover in time before you can be hit or thrown. This move also gives Q his best distance for karathrowing, although it throws the opponent behind you unless you have crazy enough timing to only press back for the punch and not for the throw. It must be parried high, although it can be difficult to parry for an opponent jumping right over you because the opponent sometimes has to parry what looks like behind himself.
Neutral standing fierce: This move knocks the opponent down and can be used as a poke against tall characters like Urien, although it isn?t very useful because it?s unsafe if it gets blocked from anywhere but max range. The only time this move is really used is to end a c&db or SAII juggle, and even then it?s used rarely because other moves are usually better options. It has to be parried high.
Back + fierce: This is a good poke, but only against opponents tall enough to get hit by it if they crouch, meaning Dudley, Urien, Hugo, Alex, and Q. It?s safe on block, beats out lots of attacks, and can even be used as a weird antiair because it?s Q?s only normal that can beat certain air attacks and is usually safe if parried because it moves Q under the opponent and past his attacks. It?s still used against characters who can duck it, but really only as a reset in c&db corner juggles. It has to be parried high.


Crouching jab: This is a quick little ranged poke that?s great for keeping the opponent out and beating slower attacks, so it should be used often. It can be parried both high and low.
Crouching strong: This is a good poke and antiair that?s safe on block and can recover in time if air parried. It can be used up close to tick into karathrow or to preemptively stuff an opponent?s wakeup jump or easily-stuffed attack. Its main drawback is that it can be parried high and low, which makes it less useful as a meaty attack since the opponent can beat it by parrying either toward or down.
Crouching fierce: This is a great meaty that is safe on block and stuffs or trades with just about all non-invincible wakeup attacks, although its startup is a little slow. Its range extends beyond and above Q?s fist, so it can also be used to stuff long-range low attacks, but that?s kinda risky because of its long startup and recovery if whiffed. It has to be blocked and parried low.

Jumping up jab: This comes out almost immediately, has great priority, and lasts the whole jump, so it?s useful as an air-to-air antiair. It must be parried high.
Jumping toward jab: The claw! This move comes out quickly, lasts almost the whole jump, and has great priority, so it?s useful to beat certain air and even antiair attacks, to retaliate with after an air-to-air parry when the opponent is in front of or above you, and to fake an empty jump by attacking at the last second. It has to be parried high.
Jumping strong: This is good against opponents that jump higher than you and against characters who are tall enough to get hit by it when standing, but it?s rarely used because Q?s other jumping attacks are usually better options. It can be whiffed into karathrow. It has to be parried high.
Jumping fierce: This is a great air move that should be used often. It?s good for starting combos and beating or trading with air attacks and antiairs, including some moves like dragon punches and headbutts. It can set up a taunt if it knocks the opponent out of the air and can also serve as a tick into c&db. It must be parried high.


Normal Kicks

Standing short: This is a nice little poke that comes out and recovers very quickly and is useful for keeping the opponent out and as a tick into c&db. It can be parried both high and low.
Far standing forward: This is an excellent poke that should be used often. It beats lots of stuff, has good range, is safe on block, can?t be ducked, and is even a decent meaty attack. It has to be parried high.
Close standing forward: This is a very important move. Aside from close standing jab, this is Q?s only (only.) cancelable and comboable ground normal attack, and unlike close standing jab, it actually combos into all of Q?s comboable specials and supers for noticeable damage It can also be used as a tick into karathrow and an occasional meaty attack. It has to be parried high.
Neutral standing roundhouse: This is safe on block and beats just about any non-invincible attack, but if whiffed or parried it?s completely unsafe. It can be used for keep-out and spacing, as a meaty attack if you think the opponent will dash back, or in anticipation of a poke from an opponent who can?t hurt you much if you miss. That said, however, its main use is as a c&db combo finisher. It has to be parried high.
Back + roundhouse: This move is almost great, but it turned out otherwise. If it touches the opponent early in its animation, it has to be blocked low, knocks down if it connects, and can be canceled into the taunt and all of Q?s specials and supers, whereas if it touches the opponent later, it can be blocked high, doesn?t knock down, and can?t be canceled. This thing's main use is against characters who can?t punish the slaps; if you do close back + roundhouse xx slaps and the opponent doesn?t parry, he?ll either get knocked down or take some block damage from the slaps. It can also be used to beat low pokes, since the early part of its animation eats up every low move in the game. The third use is as a preemptive antiair, for when you think the opponent might jump back on wakeup and you?re a little distance away. Unfortunately, this move has huge recovery time if uncanceled or whiffed, can?t cancel into anything quickly enough to escape an option-select parry/throw, can't actually combo into anything, and can be parried both high and low at any stage of its animation.

Crouching short: This is a decent poke. Its startup is a little slower and it doesn?t beat as many things as crouching jab, but it has slightly longer range and must be blocked and parried low.
Crouching forward: This is also a decent poke that does more damage than crouching short but is a little slower to come out. It?s also Q?s best meter-building attack. It has to be blocked and parried low.
Crouching roundhouse: This move knocks the opponent down if it connects, but if it doesn?t it can be punished by anything. It?s a decent meaty because it beats everything except moves with invincible startup, like some supers and dragon punches, and it?s also useful as a situational antiair, but it?s risky because of its super long recovery on block and parry. It has to be blocked and parried low.

Jumping short: This comes out as fast, lasts as long, and has as good priority as jumping toward jab, but it?s used differently because its hitbox is lower. It?s useful for beating air attacks and some antiairs, retaliating after an air-to-air parry when the opponent is lower in the air than you are or when you jump straight up, for changing the timing on a fake empty jump, and for ticking into karathrow. It must be parried high.
Jumping forward: This is a great move and is one of the air moves you should use the most. It has great range, beats lots of stuff, is a useful defensive poke, and is a good spacer. It must be parried high.
Jumping roundhouse: This is another great air move. It stuffs a lot of things and trades with many of the rest, even some that have invincibility frames because its oddly-shaped hitbox sometimes hits the opponent in an area where he doesn?t have invincibility. It?s Q?s only jumping attack that knocks the opponent down out of the air instead of resetting them and has deceptively good range and hit stun, can also be used as a tick, to zone the opponent out, to whiff a jump-in to throw, and is also the most damaging way to start a combo. Also, if you do it so that it hits as late as possible, like around the level of the opponent?s feet, it can?t be punished if it gets parried. It has to be parried high.


Other Attacks

Universal overhead: Q?s uoh is slower and floatier than that of most characters, but it also has better range. It?s a decent poke and can be used to link into super if it?s done at max range or as a deep meaty. If you do it as a deep meaty, you can also link into close standing forward, standing short, and crouching jab. On some character you can use this for tricky ground uoh crossovers when the opponent is waking up.

Neutral throw: It does more damage than the toward or back throw and leaves the opponent right next to Q, which is good if you need the extra damage, don?t need a taunt, or want to play close to the opponent. The regular range is longer than many characters? normal throws, but unless you?re trying to tech a throw or otherwise need a throw to come out as soon as possible, you should use the kara throw (same thing with the toward/back throws).
Toward/back throw: One throws the opponent in front of Q and the other throws him behind. The opponent gets thrown a little distance away from Q, so this can set up taunts in certain situations. This is also good if you don?t want the opponent right next to you, which is usually the case with Q. Also, I don?t have the exact data, but it seems to me like the toward throw has more range than the neutral throw.


Part 3: Frame Data

StreakSRM?s old site, www.karathrow.com, isn?t up anymore, but here?s the archived Q info page . Unfortunately some of the frame data is missing, and also unfortunately this is the information for the Dreamcast version of the game, which is slightly different in a some ways from the arcade/PS2 version, but it?s the best English translation of this stuff around.


Part 4: Useful Combos Etc


Combos that work anywhere (everyone)

(Optional Jumping medium/heavy attack or meaty uoh) close standing forward xx jab/strong/ex dash punch
(Jumping medium/heavy attack or meaty uoh) close standing forward xx jab/strong dash punch xx SAI/SAII
(Jumping medium/heavy attack or meaty uoh) close standing forward xx jab/strong/ex slaps
(Opponent crouching) overhead dash punch, link to SAII
EX low dash punch (one hit) xx SAI
Short c&db, SAII
Short c&db, fierce slaps
Universal overhead, SAI/SAII

Midscreen combos

(Jumping medium/heavy attack or meaty uoh) Close standing forward xx ex dash punch, neutral standing roundhouse
Roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch (everyone)
Roundhouse c&db, fierce dash punch (Yun, Yang, Ibuki, Remy, Oro)
Roundhouse c&db, ex dash punch, neutral standing roundhouse/fierce (everyone)
Roundhouse c&db, jab overhead dash punch, ex dash punch xx SAI (Sean, Akuma, Chun, Makoto, Ryu, Dudley, Elena, Ken)
Roundhouse c&db, strong overhead dash punch, ex dash punch xx SAI (Yun, Yang, Ibuki, Oro)
Forward c&db, jab overhead dash punch, ex dash punch xx SAI (Remy)
Roundhouse c&db, jab overhead dash punch, strong dash punch xx SAII (Sean, Akuma, Chun, Makoto, Ryu, Dudley, Elena, Ken)
Roundhouse c&db, strong overhead dash punch, strong dash punch xx SAII (Yun, Yang, Ibuki, Oro)
Roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, fierce dash punch (Chun)
Forward c&db, jab overhead dash punch, strong dash punch xx SAII (Remy)
SAII, fierce dash punch (everyone)
*Note: c&db, overhead dash punch, dash punch combos do not work on Hugo, Alex, Necro, Q, Urien, or Twelve)

Opponent almost cornered combos (everyone)

Roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, jab/strong/ex dash punch (choice between jab/strong depends on distance to wall)
Roundhouse c&db, fierce dash punch, jab/strong/ex dash punch (choice between jab/strong depends on distance to wall, Yun, Yang, Ibuki, Remy, Oro only)
Roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, neutral standing strong (reset)
Roundhouse c&db, ex dash punch, neutral standing strong (reset)
Roundhouse c&db, ex dash punch, neutral standing roundhouse
(Jumping medium/heavy attack or meaty uoh) close standing forward xx ex dash punch, neutral standing strong (reset)
(Jumping medium/heavy attack or meaty uoh) close standing forward xx ex dash punch, neutral standing roundhouse
SAII, strong dash punch
SAII, neutral standing fierce/roundhouse
Antiair slaps (one hit), neutral standing strong (reset)
Antiair slaps (one hit), jab/ex dash punch
Antiair dash punch, neutral standing strong (reset)
Antiair dash punch, jab/ex dash punch

Corner combos

Roundhouse c&db, fierce dash punch, strong/ex dash punch (Yun, Yang, Ibuki, Remy)
Roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, strong/ex dash punch (Oro, Alex, Q, Dudley, Makoto, Elena, Chun)
Roundhouse c&db, jab dash punch, jab/ex dash punch (Ken, Ryu, Sean, Akuma, Twelve, Necro, Urien)
Roundhouse c&db, fierce dash punch, strong slaps (Yun, Yang, Ibuki, Remy)
Roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, strong slaps (Oro, Alex, Q, Dudley, Makoto)
Roundhouse c&db, jab dash punch, strong slaps (Ken, Ryu, Sean, Akuma, Chun, Twelve, Elena, Necro, Urien)
Roundhouse c&db, fierce dash punch, back + fierce (reset) (Yun, Yang, Ibuki, Remy)
Roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, back + fierce (reset) (Alex, Oro, Q, Dudley, Makoto)
Roundhouse c&db, jab dash punch, back + fierce (reset) (Ken, Ryu, Sean, Akuma, Chun, Twelve, Elena, Necro, Urien, Hugo)
SAII, strong dash punch (everyone)
SAII, neutral standing fierce/roundhouse (everyone)
Antiair slaps (one hit), jab/ex dash punch (everyone)
Antiair slaps (one hit), back + fierce (reset) (everyone)
Antiair dash punch, jab/ex dash punch (everyone)
Antiair dash punch, back + fierce (reset) (everyone)

Q is cornered or almost cornered combos (everyone)

Roundhouse c&db, ex dash punch, jab/ex dash punch
(Jumping medium/heavy attack or meaty uoh) close standing forward xx ex dash punch, jab/ex dash punch
Roundhouse c&db, ex dash punch, neutral standing strong (reset)

Resets into super

Close anti-air standing jab, dash toward, SAII
Forward c&db, jumping toward jab, SAII
(Opponent cornered) Roundhouse c&db, jumping toward anything-other-than-roundhouse, SAII
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    Part 5: Stuff About Q


    Defense: Blocking, parrying, and throw teching are crucial. Q doesn?t have too many defensive options in a lot of cases, so your best bet is usually only what the game engine gives you.

    Also, keep in mind that since Q is one of the tallest characters in the game, he can get hit by just about everything, always. While this is in large sense a disadvantage, if you learn to red-parry things, you can sometimes turn it to your advantage. If you don?t mind taking a risk, you can red parry the second or third of an obviously-chained attack, like Yang?s jumping forward to forward dive kick chain, Ken?s close standing strong to fierce chain, or the third hit of Akuma?s hurricane kick. The benefit of getting a red-parry is obvious, but doing so is hard and takes lots of practice and is still a risk even if you?re good on the timing, especially considering that the timings on many target chains can be varied.

    Sometimes, you're better off escaping a situation rather than trying to block, tech, or attack your way out of it. One way to do this is to dash punch under an opponent?s jump. Doing a fierce dash punch will obviously move you the farthest, and that?s great if you want to try to set up a distance game or run away or whatever. You can also do a jab/strong dash punch so that you land just behind the opponent in order to, depending on the situation, throw/hit him or effectively put him in the corner. Another way to escape is by doing SAI, which is good because you might do some damage in the process, and it?s still pretty safe, depending on the character. You can even just regular dash toward or backward. Reasons to do this include wanting to run out the clock, get into a better position, escape a command grab, play a runaway game, and so on. Keep it in your bag of tricks.

    Taunts: Taunting is pretty important. Q normally takes the second-least damage in the game among playable characters, but with taunts he gets the game?s best defense. A Q jumping fierce, close standing forward, SAII, fierce dash punch combo usually deals 93 damage points to Q, but he takes 76 after one taunt, 65 after two, and 54 after three, meaning that Q gets about 40% off of the damage he normally takes. The taunts stop giving bonuses after the third taunt, and the bonuses only last for one round, so you have to try to taunt three times in every round. I tend to think of the taunts not as making Q take less damage, which is what they really do, but as extending his health bar off screen. This helps me realize that taunting while losing a bit of health actually lets me take more total hits without dying than if I hadn?t taunted and still had full health, and so is worth it. You can essentially lose more than a third of your health bar and still have more total damage-taking power if you have three taunts than if you had a full health bar and no taunts.

    Think of taunting as an advantage instead of a necessity, though. Take into account not only your health bar but your positioning and other opportunities, and only taunt if it gives you an advantage over all. Taunting in Ken?s face isn?t worth it, for example, but if you?re just gonna get hit by a full screen fireball or if you?re up against a meter-less Chun, fine, do it. If you land ex dash punch to neutral standing roundhouse about 2/3 of the way to one side of the screen, consider that while you could taunt after, leaving you across the screen from your cornered opponent, you could also do a fierce dash punch to leave you right on top of your opponent in the corner. Recognize that what is most advantageous is not always a taunt.

    There are a bunch of ways to set up taunts. Air-to-air jumping fierce and ex slaps will get you a taunt against characters who can?t hurt you fast from far away. You get a free one after SAI, a free one after SAII if you do a follow-up, and two free ones after SAII if you don?t do a follow-up. You also get a free taunt after any c&db combo that doesn?t end in a reset, but against certain characters (characters who get up late), if you do midscreen short c&db, fierce slaps, you get two free ones. An antiair dash punch will also give you a free taunt. Doing a back/toward throw can give you enough time to taunt against certain characters or if your opponent doesn?t expect a taunt. You can taunt if you?re reasonably far away and aren?t facing a character that can cover ground quickly, and you can also taunt in an opponent?s face if you?re against a character that can?t painfully punish you. You can even get the opponent into a rhythm by doing something a few times in a row to make him move backward or attack, and then when he expects you to do it again, use that rhythm to taunt instead. Take advantage of players who want to run away or turtle by taunting as well.


    Supers: Q?s SAI and SAII are both pretty good, and SAI is actually one of the better supers in the game. SAIII, on the other hand, is totally useless, but if you wanna just mess around with it here?s Drunken Master's Total Destruction Guide.

    SAI can hit slowly-recovering distance moves (like the shoto sweep) because its 6-frame startup moves so far forward so quickly. Also, if an opponent is crouching when they?re hit by SAI, they stay crouching the whole time, and since crouching opponents take more damage, SAI will take off a good 40+% on most characters. SAI also has invincibility for its first few frames, meaning that it can go through meaty attacks as well as projectiles, making your matchups against characters that depend on them a little more manageable. Plus, if the opponent is attacking on the way down from a jump and is getting close to the ground, SAI will transport him to the ground for the full 5 hits. If your SAI whiffs, like if the opponent jumped or something, some characters have trouble punishing it.

    SAII has faster 3-frame startup but has less range than SAI and only has one bar, but it does more damage. Q actually steps toward the opponent a little bit, so the range is longer than you would expect, and it extends slightly above and slightly below where Q?s fist actually is. It?s partially invincible in the first few frames, but it loses to attacks that come from above and behind Q?s fist and from below and far away. It?s useful as a situational antiair, especially against Dudley, whose jump arc lends itself well to being hit by SAII, and against dive kicks that go in front of you. It also trades with other high-priority supers for the first hit, but that?s a bad trade because you?ve used your whole bar to deal comparatively little damage. The problems with SAII are that the range isn?t as good as that of SAI and you only have one bar, which doesn't work well with ex attacks.

    It?s also important to note that both SAI and SAII can be beaten by command throws, semi-throws, and even normal throws. This rarely comes into play, but the characters it comes into play against most often are Makoto, Hugo, Alex, and Q.

    I generally go with SAI unless there's a compelling reason to do otherwise, like some character-specific thing or a difference in the way a human opponent plays. There are a couple of reasons for preferring SAI. One is that SAII doesn?t have the range that SAI has. Another is that SAI is better for escaping situations. Yes, it can be punished if whiffed, but in many cases only if the opponent wasn?t in the midst of performing some other move, and in many cases only for small damage. It deals with dive kick pressure better in that it beats or escapes dive kicks that are right on top of you. Since you have two shorter bars, you also get super more easily and can use ex attacks without losing super. I pick SAII against certain characters, as will be discussed below, and if my human opponent likes using his character in a way that makes SAII a better option, like if he takes fewer risks and gives you fewer opportunities, likes to use certain moves, or likes to move around the stage in certain ways.

    Random supering is a trick you need to have up your sleeve, because aside from parrying, it?s the only thing Q has that can beat meaty attacks. That isn?t the only time you can random super, though. Other times to do random supers are after a blocked dash punch (if you think the opponent might attack to try to control your post-dash punch options), between your opponent's poke strings, after an empty jump (if you?re expecting a poke meant to control your post-jump options), after the opponent parries a dash punch (if you think the opponent might retaliate immediately), in expectation of a meter-less Chun?s neutral standing fierce, etc. You shouldn?t pull this out often, but your opponent needs to know that you?re capable of it.

    You also have to learn to cancel into super on reaction. Every time you do a dash punch or universal overhead, make sure you buffer in the quarter circle forward, quarter circle forward super motion, and if you see your attack connect, drum those punch buttons. That should be guaranteed damage.


    Normals: You?ll use some of Q?s normals often and some rarely, but you?ll need all of them in your bag of tricks to succeed. The ones you should use the most are far/close standing forward, crouching jab, crouching forward, crouching strong, and back + strong, but universal overhead, far standing jab, back + fierce, crouching short, far standing roundhouse, back + roundhouse, crouching roundhouse, and crouching fierce have their uses too. Note that Q?s only overhead aside from the overhead dash punch is the universal overhead, so make sure you use it. You don?t want to give your opponent the luxury of only having to block down when you?re on the ground.

    Q also has some decent meaty attacks, that is, attacks you use when the opponent is waking up in order to poke, pressure, stuff opponents? reversals, and begin combos. The useful ones include crouching forward, close standing forward, crouching strong, crouching short, far standing forward, back + strong, crouching fierce, crouching roundhouse, back + roundhouse, universal overhead, regular slaps, and ex slaps. Each one has different properties and should be used in different circumstances. Crouching roundhouse and crouching fierce will trade with or stuff anything that doesn?t have invincibility frames Also, if you do the universal overhead as a deep close meaty, you can combo it into close standing forward. Not only is this a great and easy way to hit confirm into super (although linking into close standing forward is not easy), but by charge partitioning through the overhead into close standing forward, you can also get a dash punch out to make the hit-confirm even easier or to continue the block string. Meaties are most useful to you when you have the opponent in the corner, since against some characters you really want to put the pressure on in there. Opponents often try to jump on wakeup when they?re cornered by Q because they know what will happen if they get command grabbed; meaty attacks can convince them to stay put. Be careful about meaties against some characters, notably those with dragon punches, flash kicks, useful wakeup supers, all that crap.


    Capture and Deadly Blow: Landing c&db always leads to lots of damage. The most damaging mid-screen c&db combo is roundhouse c&db, ex dash punch, neutral standing roundhouse. If you don?t have meter, the most damaging midscreen combo is roundhouse c&db, jab/strong overhead dash punch, strong/ex dash punch against characters who can get hit by it; roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch against characters who can?t get hit by the overhead dash punch; roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, fierce dash punch against Chun; and forward c&db, strong dash punch, jab dash punch against Remy. The most damaging corner c&db combos are roundhouse c&db, fierce dash punch, strong/ex dash punch against smaller characters; roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, strong/ex dash punch against the characters who can get hit by it; and roundhouse c&db, jab dash punch, jab/ex dash punch against the others (jab-jab characters). You can substitute strong slaps for the second jab dash punch against the jab-jab characters because it?s a little easier to time, but it does a little less damage.

    There?s usually no reason to use any strength other than roundhouse for c&db. You can use short c&db, fierce slaps to get yourself two taunts against characters who get up slowly, and some of the juggles don?t work on Remy unless you use forward c&db, but that?s about it. The difference in startup and recovery of the different strengths are basically negligible. All of the versions have great range, even longer than that of Hugo?s Gigas Breaker, although if you do c&db at the same time as Hugo does Gigas Breaker, Gigas Breaker wins.

    Like with taunting, there are lots of ways to land c&db, and dependence on one way or another will get you punished. You can use ticks like close/far standing jab, standing short, crouching short, jumping roundhouse, jumping fierce, and universal overhead. Another way to do it is as an antiair. If your opponent tries to jump in a few times and is denied by an antiair attack, chances are he?ll either stop jumping, which is fine for you because you?ve removed one of his ways of hurting you, or he?ll eventually try to empty jump with a parry ready. If it looks like he is indeed empty jumping, toss out a c&db to catch him as he lands. You can also get the opponent accustomed to blocking a string like standing short, standing short, far standing forward; low jab, low short, far standing forward; universal overhead, standing short; universal overhead, crouching short, universal overhead; or jumping fierce/roundhouse, close standing forward. Once they get used to a string, replace the third or even second attack with a c&db. There?s also the very risky c&db when you?re waking up, if you think the opponent is just gonna sit there waiting to block a random super or something.

    Nobody wants to get command grabbed by Q, so they?ll usually try to escape, more often with a jump than a wakeup dragon punch or super because it's safer. This is a great opportunity to use standing forward to dash punch, slaps, back + roundhouse into slaps, back + strong, back + fierce, crouching strong, crouching fierce, crouching forward, karathrow, or a dash punch that can be followed up with a reset or strong slaps if the opponent jumped. If you think they?ll try to escape with a dragon punch or super, you can just sit there and block or down parry, which is good because it covers the attacks your opponent is most likely to use on wakeup, including dragon punches, flash kicks, crouching attacks, jabs, and shorts. Just the very act of NOT attacking can teach your opponent that it?s ok to sit in the corner, and that?s a great chance for you to c&db them.

    Also, resets when the opponent is cornered are rarely the best option. Doing two dash punches or a dash punch followed by strong slaps will give you a free taunt, so if you aren?t taunted out, don?t give up the chance to do it. There are also some things that you can only use if you knock the opponent down, like deep meaty uoh, uoh ground crossup, and close standing forward to dash punch. I generally go for the knockdown; I only do a reset if I?m already maxed on taunts or if I think the opponent isn?t expecting it.

    C&db is important, but it?s not so important to land as you might think. Sure, a single corner c&db combo can take up to a third of the opponent?s life, but that means the opponent has an incentive to not sit there when waking up. Plus, some characters spend such little time standing still or empty jumping that it?s very rare for them to be in a position where they can get grabbed. It?s also slow enough so that players with great reflexes can see it and jump out of it. This isn?t to say that c&db is useless, though, because it definitely isn?t. Some characters are really susceptible to it and can be grabbed fairly often, but c&db?s real usefulness is in frightening the opponent into doing something stupid. You need the opponent to fear c&db when he?s waking up enough that he?ll try a wakeup jump, giving you a chance to hurt him. For that reason, your opponent has to know that you?re willing to try it.

    Something else you should know is how to superjump cancel, where you cancel a superjump?s startup frames into a command move and get invincibility from throws during the canceled startup. To do it with a c&db, do a half circle back but quickly keep going until the joystick hits the jump region and then press kick. Q will flash a little (the flash being the first frames of the canceled superjump) and the c&db will come out. Q has a superjump startup of 6 frames, so for those 6 frames you can?t be thrown. This isn?t all that useful, but it?s a cool trick.

    Also, if you?re up against one of the characters Q can ground-crossover with a universal overhead, consider doing c&db without a follow-up attack. Quick recovering isn?t possible after a c&db if there?s no follow-up before the opponent hits the ground, so he?ll be stuck and you can be tricky. This is even less useful, but it?s even more cool.
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    Part 5 Continued: More Stuff About Q


    Combos: You need to know all the different button strengths and timings and endings associated with c&db juggles and all the different ways to cancel or link into super. Always be on the lookout for ways to combo, even though you probably won?t get to do it all that often. For example, even if you jump in deep with fierce and it doesn?t hit, you should at least sometimes still do close standing forward and then either jab slaps or strong dash punch. Sometimes the opponent will stop blocking after the jump-in or the close standing forward out of an expectation that you?ll stop or do a c&db.

    Q?s most damaging regular combo is jumping roundhouse, close standing forward xx strong dash punch xx SAII, fierce dash punch (substituting SAI for SAII does a little less); the most damaging regular combo without meter is jumping roundhouse, close standing forward xx strong dash punch. The most damaging midscreen c&db combo is roundhouse c&db, ex dash punch, neutral standing roundhouse; the most damaging midscreen c&db combo without meter is roundhouse c&db, jab/strong overhead dash punch, strong dash punch, or if that doesn?t work on your opponent, it?s just roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch. The most damaging c&db corner combo is roundhouse c&db, jab/strong/fierce dash punch, ex dash punch; the most damaging c&db corner combo without meter is roundhouse c&db, jab/strong/fierce dash punch, jab/strong dash punch.

    About the resets into super, they?re rarely useful but not exactly useless. SAI only hits once on reset, and since resetting into super reduces the super?s damage considerably, you lose one whole bar of SAI for comparatively negligible damage, and if you have SAII you lose all your meter for a lot less damage than usual. The reset can still be useful if you can kill your opponent with it, but usually resets are really more of a gimmick for Q.

    The only other move that?s useful for Q to kara cancel into is the universal overhead, which is really easy. Press the strong button without any directional input and immediately after tap the forward button; negative edge from the strong button combined with tapping the forward button equals a universal overhead, with a quick neutral standing strong kara canceled beforehand. This is useful because you get crazy range on the universal overhead, like easily a quarter of a screen?s distance. This makes a good overhead poke, and since you need to be at max-range to link a non-meaty uoh into super, this is useful for that too. It?s a nice thing to keep in mind when playing against characters with pokes that are very low to the ground that can be hopped over.


    Kara canceling: This is where you use a command move to cut off a normal attack?s startup animation after just a few frames by tapping the button of the normal you want to cancel and almost immediately doing or completing the move you want to cancel into. The timing is similar to the timing you naturally use when quickly drumming your fingers in boredom.

    In general, the most useful move to kara cancel into is Q?s normal throw because he gains pretty crazy range, tied with Chun for the most in the game. The normal with the best range is back + strong, but neutral standing strong is a great one too. Use back + strong if you need the extra range and don?t mind the fact that the opponent will get thrown behind you, like when you?re cornered or at midscreen or when the extra range is necessary. Use neutral strong or toward + strong if you want to keep the opponent in front of you. No, toward + strong and neutral strong are not different normals, but Q?s neutral throw and toward throw are different. The neutral throw leaves the opponent right next to you, whereas the toward throw puts him farther away and, I believe, has a little more range. Whether or not you do neutral strong or toward + strong should depend on where you want the opponent to be and whether you need the extra range. I almost always choose between toward + strong and back + strong.

    Since your throw range when done with a kara is better than everyone else?s except Chun?s, you can beat out lots of throw attempts, stop up-close poke strings, etc. Setups include close standing forward, standing short, close crouching forward, close crouching strong, crouching short, a jump-in, universal overhead, a step or dash up, dash back to dash toward, throw to re-throw in the corner, and anything else you can come up with. Don?t use it every time, though, since in situations where you don?t have much time to throw, like when trying to tech an opponent?s throw, the extra frames canceled from the normal attack can hurt you in that the throw part of the kara throw often won?t come out in time to tech.


    Partitioning: This is where you split up the charge or directional inputs for an attack, like a dash punch or super. You can hold back, dash forward, immediately hold back during the dash, dash forward again, hold back during the dash again, and then press forward and punch and you?ll still do a dash punch. You can use anything to partition, not just dashes. For Q this is only marginally useful. If you dash up to the opponent, he might not expect a dash punch or a low or overhead dash punch, so bringing one out can be unexpected/good. Even though the low dash punch is unsafe on block, it?s not AS unsafe as Q?s other low sweep, crouching roundhouse, and it has a much faster startup and a longer range.

    You can also partition command moves that require charging or multiple directional inputs to allow you to do the move while switching sides. Always charge back in relation to the where the opponent is, so if you?re charging back and the opponent jumps over you or gets thrown over you by the end of SAI, just switch your charge to the other side when the opponent switches sides. This is why, for example, you?ll sometimes get a dash punch if you?ve been charging back and the opponent jumps over you and you go to toward throw him immediately after. Also, if you?re doing a uoh ground crossover (with you on the left and the opponent on the right) and you want to do a super immediately upon landing, do it thusly: as you're doing the uoh, meaning the opponent is in front (to the right) of you, do a quarter circle to the right, but then once you land and you're on the opposite side, do a quarter circle to the left, and then push punch.


    Start-game Strategy: You should start the round based on your opponent's character and playstyle. For example, against Q, Makoto players often choose between a toward dash, hayate, forward SAII, back dash, or blocking; crouching short is an easy way to stop the toward dash and hayate, and it can?t be punished in time by SAII. Different characters obviously like doing different things on startup, so learn what each character likes to do and figure out what makes sense for you to do accordingly.


    End-game Strategy: There are two ways of thinking about this. One is that at the end of a round, some things become viable strategies that would not be advisable during the beginning or middle of the round. If your opponent is waking up and you?re next to them, options like the chip kill and c&db become decent options. The move that does the most chip damage is SAI, followed by ex slaps and regular slaps, but SAI is easier to red parry mid-move than ex slaps is. Personally, though, I rarely go for chip damage at the end of the round. Q?s only real chip damage options are all toward parryable, meaning that if your opponent thinks you?re gonna chip them, all they have to do is press toward. Your opponent can also just red parry your chip move; it?s rare that that?ll happen, but because the timing on special moves is always the same, it only takes a little practice to learn the timing for red parrying SAI or the slaps. If you?re waking up with no life and the opponent is right on top of you, though, the wakeup parry and wakeup super go from weak to useful at the end of the round. These are also risky, though; they lose to easy and obvious things like throws and jumps. Something else is that resets into super become more reasonable. Whereas they?re usually just gimmicks for Q, if all it will take to kill the opponent after a close standing jab antiair reset is a single damage-reduced hit of SAI or the full damage-reduced SAII, it isn?t unwise to do it.

    The other way of thinking about the end of the round is that it should be treated the same as the rest of the round. After all, if you?ve gotten your opponent down to no life, you must have been doing something right; why abandon strategies that have worked for the rest of the round for something else at an arbitrary level of your opponent?s life? This way is less risky than the first, and minimizing risk is generally advisable and generally the way I go these days. I used to use the first option a lot, switching between the chip kill and c&db, but that no longer seems like a good idea to me. Remember, at the end of his life your opponent has the same options you have when you have no life, so for him things like wakeup supers or parries become more acceptable as well; committing to unsafe and easily punishable things like the chip kill and c&db can really leave you open. I generally prefer to do what I normally do mid-round at the end of the round. If I want to run or turtle, I?ll keep doing that; if I want to pressure, I?ll keep doing that; and if I want to just sit there next to the opponent, I?ll keep doing that. That said, I still occasionally mix in a chip kill or whatever at the end, you know, just to keep the opponent guessing.


    Random things: Q can?t be crossed up in the corner. You can do a ground crossup by doing a universal overhead right next to the opponent just as they wake up against Yang, Yun, Remy, and Chun if you?re midscreen and against Chun, Oro, Elena, and Makoto if you?re in the corner, although this won?t work if the opponent quick stands. Chun, Oro, Elena, Remy, Yun, Yang, and Ibuki can duck Q?s normal dash punch unless you do it at just the right distance, and you sometimes can?t combo close standing forward to dash punch against Chun, Ibuki, Yun, and Yang when they?re crouching. Oro can always dash toward or backward under regular dash punches and Twelve can always walk toward or backward under them.
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    Part 6: Matchup Win-Loss Expectancy


    Retarded tier
    Makoto, 1.5-8.5: Q is terribly disadvantaged at all times

    Bad tier
    Chun, 2-8: shuts down Q?s ground game, can easily punish Q
    Ken, 2-8: great at everything, severely limits Q?s movement, very damaging
    Akuma, 2.5-7.5: can lock Q down very effectively, dominates most of the match
    Urien, 3-7: outprioritizes Q?s moves, very damaging, hard for Q to get in
    Yun, 3-7: Genei Jin pressure bastes Q

    Pretty Hard tier
    Ibuki, 3.5-6.5: can lock Q down, but it takes her forever to kill Q and Q can run away well and deal big damage fast
    Elena, 3.5-6.5: beats a lot of Q?s attacks, can mix him up well, but individual attacks aren't very damaging
    Alex, 3.5-6.5: very scary for Q up close, but Q can zone alright
    Oro, 3.5-6.5: Oro is good at zoning Q out, but can only rarely deal significant damage

    Not-Awful tier
    Dudley, 3.5-6.5: Dudley is very damaging up close and makes it hard to taunt, but Q can keep him out well
    Remy, 3.5-6.5: can keep Q out, but doesn?t take damage well, SAI makes him think twice about discs
    Yang, 3.5-6.5: constant pressure and dive kicks are annoying, but Q can keep him out and can pressure him well
    Ryu, 4-6: can poke Q well, can deal damage quickly, but Q can zone well
    Necro, 4-6: hard for Q to get out of the corner, air raids are difficult to deal with, hard to push Necro into the corner, but Q doesn?t stun easily, hard for Necro to get out if cornered

    Fine tier
    Q, 5-5: even, obviously
    Hugo, 5-5: both deal big damage, Q can taunt easily, can play offensively, pretty even matchup
    Twelve, 6-4: can control space well, but doesn?t deal much damage, can be ruined in just a few hits, and Q can poke and corner him well
    Sean, 6.5-3.5: Sean kinda sucks


    Part 7: General Notes on Matchups

    About the ranking process, while these numbers mostly come from my personal experience as a Q player, they also come from conversations I've had with other high level Q players, videos of high level Q play, Japanese matchup charts, and general observations on how things usually go. The reason it's not just based on my own experiences is that everyone, including me, does better or worse against certain characters. For example, I lose to Ken and Akuma way more than 7.5 of ten and to Alex way more than 3.5, but I win more than 2 of ten against Yun and Chun; in the same way, I know a guy who does well against Akuma but loses badly to Dudley. I hope this list gets around that kind of personal bias and represents a more evened view.

    If you hadn't noticed, Q only has two even matchups and two winning matchups, and since those four matchups involve extremely unpopular characters, you'll almost exclusively face uphill battles, especially in tournaments.


    Part 8: Character-Specific Advice

    Makoto
    Super: SAI. I choose SAI here because of the extra super bar and because it?s better in random situations.
    Important pokes/attacks: Standing short, standing forward, back + strong, crouching forward, crouching short, crouching jab, jab slaps
    Strategy: It's like Makoto was specifically designed to counter Q. She dominates Q all over the place, from her air attacks to her ground pokes to her command grab to her speed. She wants to be close to you to force you to guess between blocking, jumping, and teching, and those guessing games are very risky for you and rarely risky for her, meaning they?ll likely end with you taking lots of damage. But there are other characters in the game who do that, and some of them do it quite effectively. The worst thing about Makoto v Q is her lack of incentives and intelligence. A single move of hers, the karakusa, beats literally everything you can do on wakeup, including blocking, parrying, poking, and random supering. Even if you jump or backdash, she recovers before you can hit her on the way down and before you?re done dashing, and if she was right next to you as you woke up her grab has enough range to catch you if you dash back. You have zero options on wakeup. Zero! This means two things. One, apart from wanting to deal more damage if you?ve decided to start jumping every time on wakeup, Makoto has no incentive to not do the same thing on you every time she knocks you down. Two, Makoto can be played brainlessly much of the round; if the Makoto player decides to do something other than command grab as you?re waking up, or if you don?t get knocked down, she can just limit her rushdown to safe guessing games. She can?t deal as much damage with her safe things as with her unsafe things, but since her guessing games are already excellent on Q without the unsafe stuff, there isn?t much incentive to do anything else (again with the lack of incentives). So what can you do? Your best bet is just to guess correctly, and since her guessing games are wildly in her favor, that probably won?t happen too often. Other than that, try playing defensively, cautiously, and reactively by using your pokes to zone her out of her poke range or, more preferably, out of her dash range. Against nearly everyone else you can play more or less methodically, you know, try to control what happens and force the opponent into certain situations. It?s usually hard to do that, considering Q?s low-tier-ness, but it?s possible. It's hard to rely on the crutch of your ability to take less damage and deal more damage more quickly than the opponent, because all the damage-reduction in the world won?t help you when you can be stunned and subsequently killed after one attack followed by one karakusa. For my money, this beats Twelve vs Ken/Elena for the worst matchup in the game.
    Random stuff: Guess right!

    Chun Li
    Super: SAI or SAII. The only reason to pick SAII is so you can do overhead dash punch to super on opponents who like ducking your dash punches.
    Important pokes/attacks: standing forward, standing short, crouching forward, kara uoh, jumping roundhouse, neutral jumping fierce, neutral jumping forward
    Strategy: You need to know how to play against the two types of Chun players, the turtles and the zoners, and you need to realize that this match has two stages: Chun without meter, and Chun with meter. Chun without meter is still better than Q, but once she gets it, the match gets much harder. You have to make sure you?re fully taunted and have done a reasonable amount of damage before she gets super. If the opponent is turtling pre-super, get some taunts and then move in with things like dash punches, overhead and low dash punches, standing roundhouse, and jumping roundhouse and fierce, and don't worry about trying to parry and take risks because the reward is generally higher than the risk. Once a turtler gets super, concentrate on staying just outside of her low forward range and just sit there trying to annoy her with neutral jumping forward, fierce, and roundhouse, standing forward, standing short, and the like. If you're playing against a zoner presuper, try to push her away or knock her down so you can get taunts, and again, don't worry about taking risks to do so. Once a zoner gets super, it's your turn to try to out-turtle her, which you can do by holding down-back, doing neutral or back jumping forward, roundhouse, and fierce, and using your karathrow when she tries to use hers.
    Random stuff: Q sometimes has to red parry the last hit of Chun?s SAII, so it?s not worth trying to parry unless it?s gonna kill you; you can still punish her well if you block with strong dash punch xx super or roundhouse c&db. Never use slaps if she has meter, since her SAII can punish you not only if she blocks your slaps but even if she gets hit by them when you?re at the range where only the first and third slaps actually hit. Chun can duck the regular dash punch unless the max range of the punch hits her precisely. Close standing forward xx dash punch randomly does not combo on ducking Chun Li. Close standing forward, ex slaps does not work on crouching Chun Li.

    Ken
    Super: SAI. You might get a c&db or two here, so you?ll want some ex meter, and you?ll want the two bars to make sure you can punish him as much as possible. The best reason to use SAI, though, is because you can punish Ken?s crouching roundhouse on block from max range with a non-reversal-timed SAI, and that makes footsies a little harder for him.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + strong, far standing jab, standing short, crouching short, crouching strong, dash punch
    Strategy: Some Kens want to rush you down and some want to zone you, and both are difficult to deal with. If you're playing against a rushdown Ken, use standing jab, standing short, standing forward, slaps (if he doesn't have super), and karathrow to keep him out. If he wants to zone you, try to go poke to poke with him, and if he gets in try to knock him back out with throws or pokes. Ideally you want him to be either about a jump's distance away or just outside of his poke range so that your antiairs and pokes can keep him at bay. If he chooses to jump, which he doesn't have to, your antiair game is pretty good at that range. Because Ken can deal big damage on you easily even without super, you shouldn't take risks and shouldn't try parrying too often. You also shouldn't jump too much, since his jumping ex hurricane kick, dragon punches, and dashes own your jump-ins. Always try to keep your face to the corner, because you can get destroyed in there pretty easily, and try to use karathrow, dash punches, or knockdowns to get out. Ken is still dangerous when you have him in the corner, so don?t bother trying to pressure him too much in there, just do something like standing outside of his poke/dash/wakeup range. Makoto aside, and even though Chun is actually harder, Ken is the hardest character for me to deal with in the game. Something about his nonsense just kills me.
    Random stuff: Ken can punish your slaps if he has super. Ken can?t duck strong slaps. Crouching short, jab/short, short xx super does not work on standing Q, but it does work on crouching Q.

    Akuma
    Super: SAI/SAII. SAI is good for going through close-to-the-ground air fireballs and teleporting Akuma to the ground for full damage, as well as for escaping dive kick and demon flip games. The main reason SAII is useful is its faster startup and ability to do full damage in the air; it?s good for punishing the hurricane kick, in particular. Dissuading Akuma from spamming roundhouse hurricane kicks, which you can only punish with SAII or a parry, is a good thing to do. This choice really depends on how your opponent plays.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, standing jab, back + strong, crouching jab, jab jumping fierce, fierce slaps, strong slaps, dash punch
    Strategy: You have to be more active here than in most matchups because this isn?t a match where you can turtle easily. Turtling will just get you caught in the corner, and it?s harder for Q to get out of the corner against Akuma than it is against nearly anyone else. If Akuma gets you in the corner, be prepared for crazy demon flip, air fireball, hurricane kick, and overhead crap, and be prepared to end up taking big damage You can try to dash punch, toward dash, close standing jab, back + strong, or jumping fierce if he goes for a demon flip when you?re standing, but it?s better to stay in the middle of the screen and keep a good third of the screen away most of the time. Play more of a run-away game than a walk-back turtle game by switching sides under him to run back the other way once you get near the corner. While you?re running, try to build super quickly, because Q depends a lot on his super in this match. Once you get super, Akuma has to change his gameplan. If you have SAI, he won?t be able to use air fireballs as much and his dive kick and demon flip games won?t be as effective because you can hit him out of the air or escape the situation altogether. If you have SAII, Akuma will know that if he messes up at all or if you get a parry, he?s dead. SAII also just plain removes some of his options, like the hurricane kick; if he does a hurricane kick of any strength and you have SAII, bam, it?s free. With super ready, you?ll be able to poke, antiair, and generally dictate the pace of the match much better than without it. You also depend on the parry more in this match than in just about any other. If you don?t have super and can?t parry, Akuma can literally spam roundhouse hurricane kick against you until you die of chip damage. Be aware, though, that Akuma can use your parrying to trap you and either make you parry difficult high-low things, normal throw you, or Raging Demon you. It really isn?t important for you to pressure Akuma in the corner, you?re better off just continuing your semi-run away game, to be honest. Be active in this match, move around, and try to build meter. For me, Akuma is tied with Ken for second-hardest to deal with after Makoto.
    Random stuff: Akuma can cancel all of his attacks into Raging Demon at any time, meaning that if you parry any of his ground attacks while he has full bars, you?re just asking to get a Demon in the face. Crouching short, jab/short, short xx super does not work on standing Q, but it does work on crouching Q. Akuma can?t duck strong slaps.

    Urien
    Super: SAI or SAII. SAI is good because it?s better for random supering on wakeup, beating Urien?s tackle xx Aegis nonsense, having meter for ex, being able to go through Aegis for the first hit, and escaping corner unblockable setups. SAII deals with Urien's jumping attacks and headbutts better and it goes through the Aegis for full damage if only Q's fist is in the reflector.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + fierce, back + strong, standing strong, crouching strong, crouching forward, standing short, strong slaps, jumping fierce, uoh, dash punch
    Strategy: One of the problems with Urien, the main problem other than the fact that Q is particularly easy for him to juggle, is that there?s no great place for you to stand. The worst places to be are right outside of his poke range and inside of his dash range, because then it's very hard for you to do damage or escape knockdowns into Aegis. The best thing to do is to pressure him more than most characters, at about the range of your pokes; if you can, try to push him backwards, try to keep pressure on him, and try to not let him knock you down. Don?t stand right next to him for fear of his close-range attacks and headbutts, and watch out because his dash is quick enough for him to punish whiffed attacks with a dash up throw. Urien players often use headbutt to escape wakeup traps, but your crouching strong, back + fierce, strong slaps, and properly-ranged dash punches eat it up for free. When he's in the corner, just stay at the same range you always stay against him when he?s in the corner, because that?s the most annoying range for him. Usually there isn't much need to jump, just use your pokes and dash punches to get around and deal damage. Using c&db is ok, but should be used rarely. If he gets a regular Aegis setup on you, just try blocking it, because doing anything else is too risky and can lead to too much damage. If he gets you in a midscreen unblockable, parry down on wakeup and then try to guess toward or down depending on which normal he uses to break your guard. If he gets you in a corner Aegis unblockable setup, reversal SAI gets out of it, but the Urien player can dash up to you and baste you before you recover.
    Random stuff: You can punish a blocked shoulder charge with super and ex slaps. If Urien does an uncanceled crouching fierce on you and you block it, you can punish it with super. Urien can?t duck back + fierce, strong slaps, or max range neutral standing strong.

    Yun
    Super: SAI or SAII. Use SAI on players who like rushing you more, since it can beat or escape dive kicks, is very useful for escaping, running away, and is a much better random super. Use SAII on more careful turtle-type players who give you fewer chances to deal damage.
    Important pokes/attacks: standing jab, standing forward, back + strong, crouching jab, crouching forward, dash punch, jumping fierce, jumping roundhouse, jumping forward, jab slaps, fierce slaps
    Strategy: Genei Jin pressure is very difficult for Q to deal with, and nothing other than SAI will beat it out. The best option you have is to try to block. If you want to take a risk, throw out a crouching jab, standing forward, or super if it looks like Yun is going for a toward + forward kick or something, but be real careful; even if you?re fully taunted, it?s not worth eating a Genei Jin combo. When Yun doesn't have Genei Jin, this is a reasonably even matchup. You can try to keep Yun at kinda mid range, like the distance where you can do a dash punch without him reacting to it, both so you can see everything coming at you and your antiairs are at their best and so he can't get meter safely. A good way to deal with dive kicks is to avoid them completely, and dash punching if Yun is in the air will help. Dive kicks can be beaten in some situations, like standing jab to beat them right in front of you, standing forward if they're well in front of you, and back + strong if the dive is coming from on top of you but hasn't started yet, but there are some ranges where all you can do is block. Taunt if the Yun is far away or jumps away, but make sure you close that distance so Yun has a hard time getting Genei Jin. Don't worry about taking risks if Yun won't get super by punishing you. If you get Yun in the corner, stay on him because he doesn't have any good options aside from ex upkicks, which Yun players rarely use so as to conserve meter. You can safely use meaties even with the threat of ex upkicks because it's so crappy, including meaties like crouching short and crouching forward. Parrying stuff, both on wakeup and in footsies, is a fine option here because you can pretty easily end up winning on damage. When Yun doesn't have Genei Jin, this isn't a bad match, it's just that Genei Jin is the best thing in the game.
    Random stuff: If Yun does a toward + forward overhead too close to you, you get a free karathrow, even when he?s in Genei Jin. Yun can do four or five palms on you when juggling you in Genei Jin without having to kara palm them, meaning that even when you have full taunts, Yun can still easily take off about 40% of your life with a corner Genei Jin combo.
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    Part 8 Continued: More Character-Specific Advice

    Ibuki
    Super: SAI/SAII. SAI is good because it blows through Ibuki?s ground and air pressuring. SAII is good because its damage potential forces Ibuki to be more careful, although it is harder to land.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + strong, standing short, crouching strong, crouching forward, jumping fierce, jab slaps, fierce slaps
    Strategy: Ibuki wants to pressure you constantly, to force you to deal with her great mixups. Fortunately for you, and the reason this matchup is only difficult instead of awful, Ibuki deals very little damage and takes a crapload of damage herself. This means two things for you. One, you can take risks; going for parries and red parries isn't a bad idea, since the risk associated with missing something is fairly minor, and taunting will increase your net life even if you get comboed because of it. Two, you can wait Ibuki out by turtling until she makes mistakes or leaves holes for you to punish. If Ibuki makes a mistake that allows you to land a super, that round should be yours. Your gameplan should basically be to play super-defensively while simultaneously being willing to take risks. While turtling, try to keep a distance between yourself and Ibuki of about slightly less than your max poke range, which is because it makes jump-ins and pokes difficult for Ibuki, since your antiairs and pokes are at their max effectiveness there. Being cornered isn?t too terrible for you, but you should look for an exit with something like a dash punch, parry, throw, or whatever else. If you get her in the corner, pressure her a little, but don't concentrate on doing meaty attacks, just stay at your preferred range and go backward if she gets closer to you. Watch out because her wakeup ex dragon punch into SAI is almost completely safe and actually does pretty good damage to you.
    Random stuff: If Ibuki does her chain into far roundhouse launcher and jumps at you, you can escape with a dash punch. If Ibuki does SAI and you block it, you can?t punish her at all; if you parry it, the only way you can punish her is with a reversal-timed SAII. You can punish a blocked Ibuki close standing roundhouse with virtually anything.

    Elena
    Supers: SAI. You should SAI both because there?s no reason to use SAII and because it deals better with Elena?s air attacks; if you?re at the spot you want to be, you can beat her otherwise super-annoying jumping roundhouse and fierce with an antiair vacuum SAI.
    Important pokes: far standing forward, back + strong, crouching strong, crouching jab, crouching short, jab slaps, strong slaps, fierce slaps
    Strategy:
    Random stuff: Q?s crouching short somehow beats Elena?s command overheads.

    Alex
    Super: SAI.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + strong, back + fierce, crouching strong, crouching forward, strong slaps
    Strategy: Alex doesn?t really have anything he can abuse against Q, it?s more just like he?s annoying for Q generally. He beats you in the air and is scary when Q is waking up, meaning you really don?t want to get knocked down and don?t want to be in the corner. It?s also hard to taunt against Alex because of the ex rushing elbow and ex stomp, both of which can knock you down on reaction and give Alex good positioning. This matchup, like most, is all about being at the sweet spot, which is at about the max distance of your poking range. You want to do a lot of poking in this matchup because Alex doesn?t have very good ground pokes. For antiair, use slaps, crouching strong, crouching roundhouse, and c&db. Don?t get too close to him, for fear of his command throws. You can pressure Alex pretty well both midscreen and in the corner, but there?s still no reason to be within his command grab range or the range where, if he does a wakeup SAII, you?ll eat all the hits instead of escaping the final throw. Wakeup stomps are kind of annoying and suck if they knock you down, but they can be easily beaten with virtually all of your corner-pressure normals, preemptive antiairs, and air attacks.
    Random stuff: Alex can?t duck back + fierce or strong slaps. Wakeup stomps can be beaten with anything that hits high up or even at mid range, basically all the same stuff that beats Urien?s wakeup headbutts. Alex?s back + fierce and powerbomb can both beat Q?s supers.

    Oro
    Super: SAII. Oro players like ducking your dash punches, and using overhead dash punch to SAII is a good way to get around that. There are few chances to use super or ex meter anyway, so not having SAI isn't bad.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + strong, crouching strong, crouching forward, jump fierce, jumping strong, jab slaps, strong slaps
    Strategy: Oro players are all about keeping you out and taking advantage of knockdowns or mistakes to land close standing strong. Oro's pokes, like standing forward, standing roundhouse, and standing strong, are hard for you to get around, but not individually very dangerous. Don't be afraid to take risks by option-selecting toward parries while poking with jab or strong slaps, standing forward, or dash punch, since Oro's ranged pokes are parryable high, slow enough to occasionally recognize and parry, and only deal minor damage anyway. Generally, you should be ok with standing where Oro wants to stand because the risks aren't really that great, but if you get closer than that, that's fine too because at that range your pokes beat his at that range. What you don't want is to get knocked down, because that gives Oro a chance to set up things that are difficult for you to deal with, like SAIII, SAII, low-high mixups, and throw-close standing forward mixups, all of which can be quite damaging. If the Oro player runs away, you should move toward him and get within poking range so that he can't build meter easily and can't play annoying jump games.
    Random stuff: Oro can dash underneath the regular dash punch. Close standing forward, ex slaps does not work on crouching Oro.

    Dudley
    Super: SAI/SAII. Dudley?s jump is at the perfect angle for you to beat it with SAII, but SAI is better for everything else.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + fierce, back + strong, crouching strong, crouching forward, crouching roundhouse, strong slaps, fierce slaps
    Strategy: While Dudley?s jump is useful for him against certain characters, it?s a big reason why this match is a decent one for you. Like with a lot of characters, you want to play at about the length he can cover in a single jump, because your antiairs, including c&db and SAII, are at the perfect angle to eat Dudley up. Once you convince him not to jump, you take away a big part of the way he usually gets in close to land damage, and he?ll be forced to dash or poke his way in. You can just about go poke for poke against him, meaning it?s just generally quite difficult for him to get in on you. If he gets you in the corner, it?s hard for you to get out, and Dudley can land big damage fast in there. That said, because he can?t really get in well, it?s hard for him to corner you unless you straight up walk into it. Don?t let that happen; you can make a nice wall with your antiairs and pokes that is difficult for Dudley to beat. If you have him in the corner, stay at about the same Dudley-jump distance away because he has a couple really good options on wakeup. Dudley wants to be up close to you; don?t let him get there.
    Random stuff: Dudley can?t duck under strong slaps and randomly can?t duck under back + fierce. It?s never safe to taunt against Dudley unless you land a super or a knockdown c&db combo.

    Remy
    Super: SAI. SAI can blow through Remy?s discs if you?re in the range where the first punch of SAI hits him, and convincing Remy not to throw discs is a huge blow to his game.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + strong, crouching forward, jab slaps, jumping roundhouse
    Strategy: Try to stay at about your poke range here. This is a great range because your pokes can make it hard for him to get discs out, you can outpoke him from that distance, and you can blow through his discs with SAI on reaction. Play cautiously when you get close to him, because if you get pushed out it?ll be hard to get back. If you do get pushed out, feel free to taunt, even if it costs you an ex disc in the mouth. In general, you do a lot more and take a lot less damage than he does, so it?ll take him a while to kill you, meaning you?re bound to get some openings. You might be stuck in the corner a bit here, but whatever, you should be used to that by now. If Remy is playing offensively, you don?t really need to jump out, you can just stay there trading pokes, waiting for him to try a walk up throw and punish it with your way better karathrow range, that sort of stuff. If you manage to corner him, don?t get hasty trying to go for big damage. Stay at the range you want; your poking and throwing should hurt him enough. Don?t bother pressuring him too much when he?s waking up with meter, since his ex flash kick and SAII beat your meaty attacks.
    Random stuff: While you can?t crouch block under Remy?s high disc, you can occasionally neutral crouch under it if Q?s hit box is at the right spot while he?s breathing, although this is essentially random and not worth trying in game. You can also use crouching short to duck under the high disc and universal overhead to hop over the low disc. Remy has a virtual get out of jail free card in ex flash kick xx SAI. Remy can?t duck under strong slaps.

    Yang
    Super: SAI. Yang depends a lot on his ground game, so apart from being good against dive kicks, SAI is great for making Yang think twice about mantis slash pressure.
    Important pokes/attacks: standing forward, back + strong, crouching forward, crouching jab, jumping fierce, jab slaps, fierce slaps
    Strategy: Yang will constantly pressure you with mantis slash games that are generally hard for you to deal with. He?s great at rushdown and wants to pressure you constantly in the form of meaty attacks like low forward, close standing strong, or slashes, and also in the form of dive kicks and command grabs. These games are annoying, but you can beat or do well against non-meaty ground pressure with far standing forward, jab slaps, and crouching forward and with dive kicks with back + strong, close standing jab, jumping fierce, and fierce slaps. Because Yang players are so pressure happy, using an occasional wakeup or random super is okay even if it doesn't connect because it'll make the opponent think twice about pressuring you, and that'll really nerf his game. Try to run away to that same sweet spot you use against Yun, about the distance it takes for him to jump and dive kick at you. If you get him in the corner it?ll be hard for him to get out, so don?t abdicate position. You should generally stick with your regular corner pressure stuff, you know, pokes, ticks into karathrow, fake ticks, etc, but you can be a little more c&db happy than usual because all of Yang's wakeups lose to it.
    Random stuff: If Yang does a toward + forward too close to you, you get a free kara throw. You can regular throw and c&db Yang out of his SAII.

    Ryu
    Super: SAI. You might get a c&db or two here, so you?ll want some ex meter, but the best reason to use SAI is to punish Ryu?s crouching roundhouse on block.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + strong, far standing jab, standing short, crouching jab, crouching forward, crouching strong, crouching roundhouse, jab slaps, fierce slaps, jumping fierce
    Strategy: Set up camp at about one Ryu jump or dash away, so that your pokes and antiairs, including c&db, are in full gear. From here, you can see what Ryu wants to do in advance and not let him do it. Watch out for his attempts to dash up and start throw games and his big-damage combos on you. Ryu is better than you are in the air and he has several pretty decent antiair options, so you shouldn?t spend too much time jumping. You don?t really even need to jump that much anyway; just use your wall of annoyance to make it hard for him to get in. If you get him in the corner, be wary about pressuring him. If you?re facing a Denjin Ryu, your SAI will power through all of his setups that leave you in range to hit him with the first hit of SAI whether or not it involves you getting knocked down. Beyond that distance, Denjin gets easier to parry.
    Random stuff: Crouching short, jab/short, short xx super does not work on standing Q, but it does work on crouching Q. Ryu can?t duck strong slaps.

    Necro
    Super: SAI.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + strong, back + fierce, crouching forward, crouching jab, crouching strong, strong slaps, fierce slaps, jumping forward, jumping roundhouse
    Strategy: Q doesn?t have very good ways to get out of the corner, and Necro is a beast when he has you cornered, so that part of this matchup is difficult. That said, Necro doesn?t have very good options when he?s cornered. Since you both fear getting cornered, this matchup is really about getting the other guy into the corner, more so than in most matchups. Get him in there with pokes and cautious rushdown. You want to be at about the distance your pokes and preemptive antiairs can reach, so not right up close to him but also not very far away. Try to make it so that he can?t start air raid games by constantly poking and preemptively antiairing with crouching strong, back + roundhouse, strong/fierce slaps, and so on. You can also play some rushdown mix-up games. Don?t play right up next to him, keep out of range of his comboable moves, but try to push him backward. Necro doesn?t have much other than parrying and blocking to stop that kind of thing, so give it a go. If Necro does get you into the corner, well, that sucks. His way of pushing you into the corner is to get right up next to you and use his high/low/throw games and twirls to knock you back. Watch out for that and air raids, which can sometimes only be stopped with a parry.
    Random stuff: Necro can?t duck strong slaps.

    Q
    Super: SAI.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + fierce, standing jab, crouching forward, crouching jab, crouching strong, jumping fierce, jumping forward, jumping roundhouse, strong slaps, fierce slaps
    Strategy: Guess.
    Random stuff: Q can?t duck back + fierce or strong slaps, and randomly can?t duck max range neutral standing strong. Q?s c&db can beat Q?s supers.

    Hugo
    Super: SAI. You might get some ex attacks in and SAI is good for countering Hugo?s super-laggy-and-long-range whiffed pokes.
    Important attacks: far standing forward, back + fierce, back + strong, crouching strong, crouching forward, strong slaps, fierce slaps, jumping roundhouse
    Strategy:
    Random stuff: Hugo can?t duck back + fierce, strong slaps, neutral standing strong, or fierce slaps. Hugo?s meatcrusher and ultra throw can beat Q?s supers.

    Twelve
    Super: SAI. You rarely have the chance to super Twelve and rarely get to use ex meter, so both supers are equally fine and unimportant, meaning SAI is the way to go.
    Important pokes/attacks: back + fierce, standing forward, standing jab, crouching strong, crouching jab, crouching roundhouse, strong slaps, fierce slaps, jumping fierce
    Strategy:
    Random stuff: Twelve can walk toward or back under the regular dash punch.

    Sean
    Super: SAI. You might get a c&db or two here, so you?ll want some ex meter, but the best reason to use SAI is to punish Sean?s crouching roundhouse on block.
    Important pokes/attacks: far standing forward, back + strong, standing jab, standing short, crouching jab, crouching strong, crouching roundhouse, jumping fierce, jumping roundhouse, jumping forward, jab slaps, fierce slaps, uoh
    Strategy: I highly doubt that you will ever meet a serious Sean player. Maybe you?ll see someone use him in a tournament, but that doesn?t mean he?s a serious Sean player, and it doesn?t mean you should have much to worry about.
    Random stuff: Sean?s dragon punch, even the ex version, can be beaten on startup by a throw. Crouching short, jab/short, short xx super does not work on standing Q, but it does work on crouching Q. Sean can?t duck strong slaps.
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    Part 7: Other Advice and Advice from Other People
    Also, don't forget that his huge girth can actually be an advantage in the fact that he can't be crossed up in the corner.. makes for easy blocking.
    locoghoul wrote:
    one thing i discovered today, taunt after air-to-air fp is not safe, ken can superjump hk, low mk into sa3.
    UltraDavid wrote:
    To CyanideAssassin's question "you mentioned the combo RH C&DB, ex rush punch, st. RH. Does the standing roundhouse do more damage or stun than the standing Fierce?" yes, the roundhouse finisher does more damage than the fierce. If you want to get the most stun out of that combo, like if the opponent just needs a sliver more of stun to fill the bar, end with a back + fierce.
    spoony wrote:
    Some things.
    Some are much more significant than others.

    1.) Far Standing forward can only be parried high. This is surprisingly significant.

    2.) A number of surprising things can screw Q's supers. No fewer than two of Hugo's grabs (running grab, throw-to-wall grab) will flatout snatch Q out of SAI. Q can be thrown out of SAII.

    3.) Q can actually do a ground cross-up! UOH against downed Makoto (mainly in the corner). Dunno who else this works on.

    4.) Q's jumping roundhouse allows him to cross-up many opponents in the corner... it's just that the roundhouse isn't actually going to hit. Jumping roundhouse actually has a few tricks... if timed right, whether it whiffs or doesn't can be surprisingly deceptive.

    5.) Although many times you don't want to stay in the corner, be aware that very few (probably none?) characters can cross-up Q via jump-ins when Q is cornered.

    7.) Q can link SAII from far standing forward, even against non-dizzied opponents. However, this only works against a very few select crouchers... Dudley, AFAIK.

    8.) Remember that you can retain charge for dash punches while doing UOH. Good for that extra little bit of surprise.

    9.) Jump cancel! Jump cancel C&DB allows you to evade literally any throw, and of course C&DB them. Good if you're psychic.

    10.) I'm pretty sure that Q can land a surefire kara throw on Makoto after a blocked dash punch.

    11.) If you want to practice hitconfirm SA from dash punch, practice with strong and fierce dash punches first. They are MUCH easier to do this with than jab, IMO.
    Oh, here's something I learned from EVO: Alex's b+hp grab can grab Q out of SAI even if Alex does it AFTER the super flash (it has to be right after though), so watch your ass if you're going to try a random super.
    spoony wrote:
    It's significant [that far standing forward can only be parried high] because practically all of his ground normals except for UOH can be parried low.

    This includes ALL of his ground-based ticks, yes, even close standing jab. wtf indeed.

    Unless you use some standing forward, an opponent who plans on guessing some parries could repeatedly try for a low parry with excellent chances of success. Furthermore, because of Q's profound absence of cancellable normals (he's got close jab, and close forward...), parried normals all but guarantee free damage for the parry-er since you cannot cancel into a special/super in an attempt to counter their retaliation.

    There is a point to using the low normals. One of them is simply ticks; low jab and company really let you exploit the massive reach of C&DB. But also a lot of his low normals are simply useful. Low forward is a very handy poke. Saying that "they don't lead to anything" isn't really a fair label, since we'd be stuck with close standing jab, UOH, and close standing forward if all we went with is "leads to something" in the sense of combos.
    UltraDavid wrote:
    I've seen TK, Riki, and Fal play against Makoto, and they essentially do what you said, that is, try to out-random her, try to guess her crap correctly and make her try to counterguess their guesses. Unfortunately, that's pretty hard. I've only seen a couple high level match vids where Q beats Makoto, and one time was when TK just guessed right all the time and another was when the Makoto player messed up a few times, like he missed karakusa to standing fierce a few times. And I know from my experience that beating high-level Makotos is really hard. I've beaten high-level and even highest-level most-other-characters with respectable win-loss ratios, but I've never taken a reasonable percentage from high-level Makotos.
    spoony wrote:
    Here's a surprisingly un-useless combo that works anywhere, on anyone:
    short C&DB, (walk forward), SAII, fierce dash punch

    Heavy characters like Hugo don't need you to walk forward, but most of the characters who are that heavy are better dealt with with SAI. The "walk forward" bit of course varies between characters, but it's not that hard to figure out.
    UltraDavid wrote:
    The reason to do the c&db, overhead dash punch, ex dash punch combo is to put yourself in a position up close to the opponent to be active and/or rush him down. Doing two regular dash punches will move both you and your opponent quite a ways toward the corner, which is good, and ending it with an ex dash punch will make the opponent end up right in front of you and you'll still get a chance to taunt. So, it's a good thing to do if you have meter to burn. I rarely do this with SAII, but that's mostly because the characters I use SAII on are hard to land c&db on in the first place. If I get a chance, though, sure, I'll use the meter. I don't think losing meter is that big of a deal, especially if you get good positioning and a taunt out of it, thereby setting yourself up to do some damage and get some meter back anyway.
    locoghoul wrote:
    also, everytime urien got me in the corner i escaped with the dash punch while he jumped, i think it's a good tip.
    JiveJuice wrote:
    Here are some corner combos:
    Roundhouse c&db, fierce dash punch, strong slaps (Yun, Yang, Ibuki, Remy)
    Roundhouse c&db, strong dash punch, strong slaps (Oro, Alex, Q, Dudley, Makoto)
    Roundhouse c&db, jab dash punch, strong slaps (Ken, Ryu, Sean, Akuma, Chun, Twelve, Elena, Necro, Urien)
    UltraDavid wrote:
    It's important to realize that, as much as c&db does huge damage and is a great addition to Q's game, his game isn't based around it. If you're getting lots of command grabs, you're probably either playing one of the few characters that are super-susceptible to it or your competition just isn't very good.

    The thing is, it's vastly in the opponent's interest for them to try whatever they can to escape c&db setups. If you've just landed a command grab combo reset in the corner, the unlikeliest thing in the world for the opponent to do is to just sit there. Why? Because all of his other options are better. If he gets command grabbed again, he loses another quarter to a third of his life. If he jumps and you try c&db, he gets a free combo, depending on his character. If he jumps and you do any non-c&db attack, from standing forward to back + strong to dash punch to crouching roundhouse to slaps, the most he?ll be damaged is, I don't know the exact numbers, but not very much. Essentially, he can do something other than stand there like two, three, or even four times in a row, and you can smack him back down each time, and he?ll only then have taken as much damage as if you had landed c&db on him. And if he has a good wakeup attack, like a dragon punch or a safe wakeup super, there's no reason for him to take any damage in the corner.

    I used to think that Q had a very scary corner game until I realized this. I used to think, hey, the opponent has three options on wakeup: jump, attack, or parry/sit there/throw (all three of which allow you to land c&db). That means you have a 33% chance of landing c&db and therefore of taking off 1/4-1/3 of the opponent's health, right? Well, if each option had the same "risk quotient" or whatever, then yeah, each option would potentially lead to the same damage taken and you'd have a 33% chance of landing c&db. You'd also be Dudley, and not Q. In reality, Q's corner game isn't that awesome, since chances are much greater that your opponent will jump or attack than sit there because of how the damage they can potentially take in each scenario differs.

    I think this is why many top level Q players don't emphasize cornering the opponent. If you notice, lots of them, even when they have the opponent cornered, sort of voluntarily back away and continue playing the keep-away game. They realize that Q's strength is not in cornering the opponent but in running away from him, so that's how they play. Yeah, if they land c&db against Yun, they can take off a third of his life, but the chances that the Yun player will just sit there are really very slim.

    This isn't to say you should never try c&db when the opponent is waking up, because you don't want to give them the option of just sitting there blocking low. It's just that it's generally safer not to, or maybe to try a karathrow instead.
    ParryAll wrote:
    I said going for another CDB after a corner reset was Ballsy, I didn't say do it every time. I should have stressed that you HARDLY EVER do it especially in tournament play. You are totally correct that the opponent is least likely to block low or try parry after the corner reset. In tournaments the first thing you should on a cornered opponent is BLOCK. The pressure is on your opponent, not you. You force an SRK, you just got 40% damage combo or more. Good players will either do nothing or jump, because they are the safest options. That's why his AA's are so effective here. Yes the damage is smaller than CDB but so what? B.HP again will take off a nice chunk + add big stun. More importantly, though, realize that if your b. HP , AA slaps, or B.HK lands, you are once again in the position for another mixup. In other words, you once again have the advantage. Your opponent will be scared to jump, and the chances they will do something stupid like throw out an SRK are greater. The advantage is always in your favor when you have someone cornered, and the best policy is to play it smart and block, but if you know your opponent is playing it safe as well, now might be the time to go for something ballsy and a possible GGPO. It's all about reading the situation and the other player. Q is MAD dangerous in the corner, probably one of the scariest in the game. Just because you haven't seen Japanese players exploit it in videos doesn't mean it isn't there. Yes, the chances they will SRK or Jump are MUCH, MUCH greater than the chances they will block low or try parry. Hence why you should throw out an AA to nail them, or bait the SRK. The most important thing to remember is that if you are successful, you are once again in the advanteous (-sic-?) situation, forcing another mixup. If an AA hit them, they will be more inclined to SRK this time. If the SRK was blocked and you put a hurting on them, they will be more inclined to jump or block low. That might be the time to AA again or get ballsy and go for the stun and/or KO.
    UltraDavid wrote:
    Well, there are a few reasons to choose [between jumping fierce and jumping roundhouse].

    Fierce is good for air-to-air when you want to get a taunt because air-to-air fierce sets up a taunt that, while not entirely safe, usually works. It's also good when you need an air attack to come out quickly. Roundhouse comes out more slowly, since Q has to do a whole flip in the air before it hits, whereas fierce comes out almost as fast as jumping jab or short. This is useful to do as a quick jump up anti-air.

    Roundhouse's hitbox really is strange, but that strangeness is also really useful. Jumping roundhouse puts Q's feet at the bottom, where the attack is, and the hittable part of his hitbox is way high up, far enough away so that Q is basically safe. It?s is useful for air-to-air when you want to knock the opponent down and leave them near you; it's also tricky because, unlike fierce, which comes out when the opponent expects an air attack to come out, roundhouse sort of unfurls itself at a weird pace, making it really hard to parry in the air. It's also good as a meaty attack if you're thinking the opponent might wake up with a dragon punch or whatever, since it'll trade with or stuff anything up to (and sometimes including) ex dragon punches and supers. It's also tricky to parry as a jump-in because the timing on it is easily varied enough so that you can choose between hitting the opponent's face, hitting the opponent's feet, or whiffing altogether. It can also stuff things that very few other air attacks in the game can, like Chun's crouching forward for example. At the end of the animation it hits opponents and limbs that are directly below Q and also a little in front of him, so you can hit opponents who can crouch really low. Whiffing a jumping roundhouse is a good way to set up a normal throw, an immediate low attack on landing, a parry in expectation of the opponent attacking, and so on. Jumping roundhouse is also the most damaging way for Q to start a combo.
    UltraDavid wrote:
    I'd also like to partially retract my statements of a couple pages ago that Q has no option to make his opponents fear punishment from holding jump while waking up enough to decide to sit still and let themselves get command grabbed instead. Q does have one option: close standing forward xx strong dash punch xx super. This is the most damaging thing he can do on the ground, and it takes anywhere from 40%-75% of the opponent's health, so it can be huge in dissuading the opponent from jumping. Unfortunately it's always toward-parryable, so you have to mix in some crouching forwards and fierces, and it also requires you to be on top of your opponent for a second before he wakes up, meaning it's really only feasible after a corner knockdown or against the characters who wake up slowly. I feel it's pretty important, though.


    Part 8: Videos




















    Otakara getter (MA) vs Nonsense (Q)


















    "

    TM (Q) v Shintaro (YU)
    TM (Q) v Kokujin (DU)
    Take (RE) v TM (Q)


    Otakara getter (MA) vs Rumina (Q)
    Tetsugoshi (Q) vs Roshihikari (YA)




    HarmoNaz (AK) v UltraDavid (Q) 1
    HarmoNaz (AK) v UltraDavid (Q) 2
    HarmoNaz (AK) v UltraDavid (Q) 3
    HarmoNaz (AK) v UltraDavid (Q) 4
    HarmoNaz (AK) v UltraDavid (Q) 5
    HarmoNaz (AK) v UltraDavid (Q) 6
    HarmoNaz (AK) v UltraDavid (Q) 7
    UltraDavid (Q) v HarmoNaz (AK) 8
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  • HuGoLiZarDHuGoLiZarD Joined: Posts: 299Registered
    I have a few questions.
    1)Is it always safe to do 2 taunts after SA1 on Ken? It feels like sometimes ken can super jump rh into SA3 and sometimes not...
    2)Why do you guys think Kuroda is always able to get ppl with that jump in rh -> mk -> rush punch -> SA1 combo? Whenever I jump in my rh is always parried or ppl would try some sort of anti air... Is it possible to switch up the timing on the jump in rh (early or late) such that the close mk would still combo?
    Paul
  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    It seems I'm retarded. Please continue browsing and pay this post no attention.
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  • lord sharkylord sharky a sharks tale Joined: Posts: 380Registered
    after doing sa1, i usually taunt then fierce dash punch if i have another meter. it's easy to hit confirm the fierce dash punch into sa1. if they parried it, you can cancel the dash punch into sa1 to punish them if they try to hit you. that's one thing i like about sa1, aside from having 2 stocks.
    worth the play

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  • nf0xnf0x Bionic Brunch Joined: Posts: 248Registered
    David, you sure air to air fp doesn't guarantee a taunt? Makoto ex hayate'd me once, but I'm pretty certain it was because we were not at full screen.

    Can someone confirm?
  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    Yep, I'm sure. You are guaranteed a taunt against most characters, that's true, but some can punish you. Take Dudley, for example. His jump is already pretty low to the ground, so he doesn't have far to fall, and then he can just do ex machine gun punch to punish you. And, of course, if you're anywhere near the corner it's safe against very few characters, since the opponent won't fly a full screen away from you.

    Edit: I updated a little bit.
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  • nf0xnf0x Bionic Brunch Joined: Posts: 248Registered
    UltraDavid wrote:
    Yep, I'm sure. You are guaranteed a taunt against most characters, that's true, but some can punish you. Take Dudley, for example. His jump is already pretty low to the ground, so he doesn't have far to fall, and then he can just do ex machine gun punch to punish you. And, of course, if you're anywhere near the corner it's safe against very few characters, since the opponent won't fly a full screen away from you.

    Edit: I updated a little bit.

    Interesting, I guess i'll be more careful. Thanks.
  • lord sharkylord sharky a sharks tale Joined: Posts: 380Registered
    just my observation, people often jump straight up or away when they get too close to Q. i think they are afraid to get grabbed or something... just a thought.:xeye:
    worth the play

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  • eddieWeddieW Ninjaturtle elw Joined: Posts: 606Registered
    if they jump straight up use b.mp if they jump back ex dash punch out of the air then s.rh... hehe:badboy:
  • cam347cam347 Joined: Posts: 841Registered
    jus thought I'd add this if it's ok with you David.

    But we're currently speaking on Twelve v.s. Q in the Twelve section. So if you need some answers go here. Even the 12 players can probably help you.

    http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=102565
    XBL- FKE SNK
  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    I cleaned some things up and added some stuff. Yay!
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    I updated and trimmed a little.
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    UltraDavid wrote:
    I updated and trimmed a little.
    Again! Also, expect more character-specific info soon. If anyone wants info on a specific matchup, let me know.
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    More info, some rearranging.
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  • SdoubleSdouble Psycho Power Joined: Posts: 708Registered
    umm i use alot of "educated guess" ex dashs is that good if you can catch some one dashing, or is passable as a punisher to a shoto sweep instead of sa1??

    i love q.. i've recently picked him up and i must say the double dash after cadb is too much fun!!

    also good info mr. ultradavid my q will be beast in no time.
    "As we advance in life we learn the limits of our abilities."
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  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    It's not a great idea to do random ex punch dash punches. They're highly punishable on block, start up a little slower than the jab dash punch, and travel about the same distance as the jab dash punch. It's much smarter to just do jab dash punch, not only because it's safer but because, if it hits, you can cancel into super and do much more damage than you would have with an ex dash punch. As for doing one after a shoto sweep, it won't work at the sweep's max range, but if the sweep isn't max range and you don't have meter for a super, I suppose that's a fine idea.
    Sdouble wrote:
    my q will be beast in no time.
    Here's to that!
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  • SanchezSanchez Needs More Powerbomb Joined: Posts: 3,155Registered
    EX dash as a shoto sweep punisher is a bad idea. The sweep is -13 and the EX dash is 14. They recover before your EX touches them. Expect to run into random SRKs and parries post sweep.

    If you don't have meter for SA1, and it wasn't a max range sweep, go for jab slaps or standing mk.
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  • SdoubleSdouble Psycho Power Joined: Posts: 708Registered
    k yeah the other dashes are better but i like to do stuff no one does ya know?

    and yeah slaps is a better idea greed or lp dash.

    umm i read your shibang on q and it's very good but maybe i forgot or something but what are his best ticks into c and deadly b?? i know lp is good but what else?
    is lk good i use that some?

    also does he have any parry baits??

    and how do you play q
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  • SanchezSanchez Needs More Powerbomb Joined: Posts: 3,155Registered
    Even jab dash after sweep is a bit of a risk. They recover as soon as jab dash comes out, allowing them to parry or try for a "psychic" SRK. However, if you have a full meter it may not that bad of an idea.

    I guess it's pretty dependant on who you're playing. My area is full of degenerates who dp after every whiffed sweep. Going for the dash quickly became a bad idea. But if your area isn't full of people like that, then by all means try for that dash punch(assuming you have a super behind it and maybe some taunts).


    Ticks-I was supposed to send this to UltraDavid quite a while ago, but forgot. I might as well post it now before I forget again.

    -Close jab xx Hk Capture: The basic tick. After a while people start to jump after the jab touches them, take heed and start using b.mp and medium slaps to counter their counter.

    -Standing lk, HK Capture: While it doesn't cancel into Capture it does hit crouching Chun and Makoto. Replacing the Capture with a standing MK will stop a fair share of retaliation pokes and assorted bullshit.

    -Standing lk, lk, Capture: Fun to throw out there every now and then. Works the same way as the above tick.

    -Crouching lk, HK Capture: Usually unexpected. Going for cr. MP or standing MP instead of the grab may stop some attempts to jump away.

    -Crouching lp, HK Capture: Same shit. It doesn't hit low but it does have more frames for you to work with on block. Crouching lp also combos into SA2 if you're gangsta like that(Please, don't try it).

    -Jump straight up MK, Capture. Wait as till you're pretty low to the ground for best results. Be sure to mix up the timing on the MK every now and then just to be safe. I recommend using this on wake up every now and then.

    -Jump in Fierce, HESITATE, Capture: Most people will start to expect the jab after the jump in and they may try to parry your shit. This'll grab their ass! Please yell "Fools, you can't parry throws" whenever you see 'em take a step forward after the jump in. You can substitute Fierce with RH for variety.

    -Standing lk, far lp, HK Capture: Now we're just being silly. Still, a lot of people don't expect to get tossed at that range.

    Some general notes-While Capture & Deadly blow is fearsome, I would try to be selective as to where and when I'd use it. The recovery on it pretty much allows every character to try for their combo exhibition of choice. Once you land C&DB a few times people will start to get scared and desperate. Use this to you advantage and start counter poking their escape attempts. You can get a lot of damage out of punishment MKs and B.MPs. Don't be so set on landing Captures that you miss out on free damage.

    Use your head and follow your heart. Q is all about PASSION!
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  • lord sharkylord sharky a sharks tale Joined: Posts: 380Registered
    st.mp on block is a good parry bait.
    but certainly a bad poke against short character...
    i often use this just to trail my opponent after they got hit w/ sa1.
    sa1 --> opponent flew on the other side of the screen --> st.strong --> dash
    just to maintain pressure on your opponent.
    saw it from a lot of vids too. ;)
    worth the play

    www.teamfarmers.tk
  • SdoubleSdouble Psycho Power Joined: Posts: 708Registered
    oh yeah greed i don't just try for c and db everytime lol. but when the chance arrives...damn it is fun to land..it just looks balla!!

    But yeah nice ticks cancelling off rh is fun, esp bf people know you can do it and you catch em dashing in lol!!
    "As we advance in life we learn the limits of our abilities."
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  • PBallaPBalla A Tru Balla Joined: Posts: 2,655Registered
    anyone know where Thongboy Bebop?s Third Strike Basics video is? can't find it on CV, i'll try IRC atm.
  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    Updated the partitioning and random stuff sections and added a sick red racing stripe.
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  • SanchezSanchez Needs More Powerbomb Joined: Posts: 3,155Registered
    Double EX Dashes and Other Useless Q Combos

    When Q is cornered(and I mean really in the fucking corner):

    [Close MK]EXdashpunch, EXdashpunch/jab dashpunch.

    This is basically useless but it's the highest damage option available when cornered without super or Capture. Keep this in mind the next time you parry something while cornered and have stock for an EX.

    MK Capture, EXdash, LK Dash Sweep.

    Looks funny. Does 4 damage less than the standard follow up. Save for the times you want to start a combo exhibition on a scrubster. Doesn't work on Alex(and possibly Urien, Hugo, 12, Necro-Will test tomorrow!).
    Mid-screen and opponent cornered

    HK Capture, Strong Dash/Jab Dash/Jab Overhead Dash, EXdash xx SA1.

    Adds one hit and 4 damage all for the low low price of one super. Save for those times when the extra damage will finish them off.

    Opponent Corner

    HK Capture, walk up LK.

    Resets real low to the ground. May catch someone off guard once. Otherwise weak and pointless.


    Note-I'll not be held responsible for any matches lost when attempting this bullshit.
    Passion and Gradualness.

    www.skullgirls.com It's a good game!
  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 5,967Registered
    I updated a bunch of stuff.
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  • skankin garbageskankin garbage ARE YOU OKAY!? Joined: Posts: 961Registered
    Hey, I just started using Q recently, and I was wondering if there were any situations where it would be the most practical thing to end a C&DB combo with B.Roundhouse XX Taunt?
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